LIVE from The NFL Combine, Seahawks GM John Schneider stops by, Los Angeles Chargers voice Matt "Money" Smith joins

This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt, the case of Lucy Letby, we unpack the story of an unimaginable tragedy that gripped the UK in 2023. But what if we didn't get the whole story? I've just been made to fit. The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapsed. What if the truth was disguised by a story we chose to believe? Oh my God, I think she might be innocent. Listen to Doubt, the case of Lucy Letby on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. Mind Games, a new podcast exploring NLP, a.k.a. neurolinguistic programming. Is it a self-help miracle, a shady hypnosis scam, or both? Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working for China's Ministry of State Security. one of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The Sixth Bureau podcast is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to The Sixth Bureau on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Volume. What is going on, everybody? John Middlecoff, 3 and Out Podcast. How are we doing? Probably better than me, because this morning I woke up, and I was going to check into my flight for Thursday morning, and there was nothing. I haven't told anyone this this morning. It's kind of embarrassing. And I looked, and I'm like, that's kind of weird. So I hit up customer service, and they're like, your flight was Wednesday morning. So I clearly scheduled the wrong day. Luckily, I guess I got travel credit and I booked tomorrow. So that was a nightmare start to the day. Woke up a little foggy after a late night, but we are here still at the combine. Your boy has a ticket to get back to Arizona where we'll just keep podcasting. But today we will have John Schneider. I don't know if you've heard of him. He just won a Super Bowl on the show. So Matt Money Smith, who is the Chargers play-by-play guy and hosts a big radio show, Petros and Money, in Los Angeles. I met him through Daniel Jeremiah last year when they were playing the Cardinals. They came to Arizona. We played some golf and hung out. I love the guy. I mean, I followed him from afar, but meeting him, he's just a great guy. He knows L.A., the Chargers, the Dodgers. They do a bunch of radio shows from Chavez Ravine. I think that's what it's still called. but he'll join us so we got a couple interviews and that will be the show today I also talked to Greg Cosell we'll probably put that on Friday's podcast and then we'll just get back to the home base and start getting back to life as normal as the combine will officially start I was about to say on the grass but I guess they play on turf here in Indy you guys know the drill subscribe to the podcast Apple Spotify and if you're looking for the video you can check it out on a little thing called Netflix but uh other than that let's dive into John Schneider okay last time I saw this man he was on zoom and it was the spring and now I'm sitting with him and he's a Super Bowl champ and it's in person in Indy Super Bowl champion John Schneider how you doing awesome good to see you yeah that was that was a fun conversation man that was like that was a good day we've gone pretty good since then yeah how's the last couple weeks been it's been nuts it's really you know like the the finality of it's really kind of overwhelming. You're like, wait, that just happened. We just followed a plan. The guys bought into it. They fought into the coaching staff. And that literally just happened. And so when your season ends, it's always like whether you make the playoffs or not, you're always like, nah. It's kind of a bummer feeling. No more football. Because it just ends. Yeah, you're just... Yeah, and it's different for guys. like you and I where you're constantly planning and you're in draft mode, you're in free agency mode. But, yeah, all of a sudden now we're here. We're like, okay, trying to get a lay of the land for the spring, see what free agency is going to look like. And we're just moving into that right away. But you do forget how late it is. But our staff has done a great job. We had really good free agency meetings during the season. And then I just got to get caught up draft-wise. I've talked to Howie and Veach about this, and you've dealt with this before. Do you feel behind right now, or are you able to keep up? Not with free agency, with the draft a little bit, because we were, you know, the day after the parade, we were. Hung over? Actually, not too bad. You know, Coors, or Bud Lights, sorry, Bud Lights. Yeah, I can't say that. Proud partners. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, no, we were in, you know, we were in the offensive – we were in draft meetings, but I was in and out, you know, because we were interviewing offensive coordinators. Oh, yeah. And so we had that going on, and then obviously we had the ownership statement. So there was just a lot going on right away. So I was in and out of those meetings a lot. But it's really just, John, it's like that personal time, you know, like your study time, you know, you've done it. Does it feel easier to handle all this? Coordinator leaving, a sale, Super Bowl, you've been in the league a long time. Yeah. Is it easier for you to handle than it would have been 15 years ago? Less stress, at least. Oh, yeah. Do you feel the same amount of pressure? No, definitely. Over time, your experiences, you bank them. Mike would say you stack them, right? Yeah. Stack all your experiences. I journal a lot, too, so that kind of helps me. How long have you been doing that? Ooh. shoot 2008 I've always heard that works something like that it works or helps yeah it just helps me kind of like alright it's like a yeah therapeutic yeah so the Sam Darnold thing did you watch a hockey game a couple days ago no it was on it was on like 6 in the morning yeah I woke up it was over well that hockey game was like just a true pure like sports story you know these guys they beat Canada yeah I feel like Sam Darnold We just don't get these as much anymore. Just like a pure, genuine, the guy's career resurrects it, Super Bowl champion. Like, it's just you're around him every day as a player and sign him, but, like, as a human being. I was telling someone, I had never, ever heard anyone say a negative thing about Sam Darnold his entire career. And that's not easy to do when it's bad. Especially in our industry, right? Yeah, yeah. And then it ends up being true. You know, like, people were asking me, you know, throughout like the playoffs and Super Bowl week and all that, like, well, when did you know that you guys were going to be a really good football team? And I honestly, it was in training camp watching Sam interact with the offensive staff and his teammates, and like it was seamless, and he was everything that everybody had talked about, just hardworking, low ego, tough, competitive, like, ton of like, you know, strong self-efficacy, but not in your face. It was awesome to witness. Don't you think going through some time, I was telling someone the other day, by the time Andy Reid got Alex Smith, kind of unfazed by everything, had just seen a lot of crap in his career. And you just kind of develop some thick skin. Where some guys, you've had some of these type players, you draft them, and they were just superstars immediately. So if it starts going the other way, they're not ready to handle it. Where when you just kind of get in the mud from day one as a player, especially when you're drafted high, you realize this shit's hard. And if you're a high-character guy and you make it out, it honestly becomes a little easier to handle everything, doesn't it? Yeah. This is not about myself, but it's an analogy. The way I started out in the industry was like Ron Wolf, Ted Thompson were my bosses. They loved to go scouting. So they would leave Tuesday morning. so I'm in I'm like 21 years old in the office with uh Mike Holmgren and Andy Reid and John Gurd and Dick Geron and Ray Rhodes and like like this whole that's crazy like yeah and so also I was just like thrown into it and then when then when I went to um Kansas City the pro director there it was just it was just much easier to your point like yeah you're you're when you're thrown into something like that it was very it was overwhelming at the time but then you just kind and keep working, and all of a sudden you're like, wait, that was rough, but it's really helped me in the future. So is the job easy now? No. No, good one. I know you've had a long day, so I'll get you out of here. You just hired, or Mike did you part of it, the new offensive coordinator from the 49ers. You lose Kubiak. How important was it to hire someone, offense for Sam? What goes into that? Yeah, Brian had coached Sam in San Francisco. and then it was really just like for Mike it was like keeping keeping like the collective together the whole group as many of the coaches as we possibly could so you know losing Clint I mean that's hard that late in the year you know so same system you know similar very similar system background with the quarterback and then just the different skill sets with the other guys that are on our staff that was most important for Mike. How many coaches on your watch, I know Pete played a big role, have become head coaches? It feels like a pretty high number. Bunch of the defensive guys. Bunch of the defensive guys, yeah. This is the first offensive guy. This is the first offensive guy. Goes well. Gus. Gus, DQ. Sala, indirectly. Sala, yeah, yeah, yeah, Robert. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dave Canales. Schottenheimer was your offensive coordinator for a minute. Yeah, Dave Canales. Yeah, there's been a good group of guys. So this week for you changed a lot over the course of your career? I know the rhythm and the timing. This day is like much bigger. This is the NFL now, John. This is bigger than it used to be. Yeah, it's like, wow. I mean, we've been cruising around here. So we had league meetings this morning, and then I'll have more league meetings tomorrow. But, yeah, me and the medical, getting all that stuff is going to be super important. But like I said, our staff's kicking butt. We've got a great group of guys. I don't know if you know any of our guys. No, I used to know more of the guys probably like five, six years ago. Okay. The interviews with the prospective future Seahawks or future NFL players or meeting with the agents for free agent guys in the league, what is more your priority this week? Here, agents. I get caught up on the draft stuff, you know, like being able to study the interviews, whether it's the canned interview they do here or in the room, you know, over at the Dome, the Zoom ones that the coaches do. that's probably that's probably increased a lot since you scouted the zoom interviews yeah um does mike come to this covid yeah yeah he's here for a couple of days but the covid really like that was like eye-opening like whoa you can really i mean you're on zoom with somebody for an hour at different moments right at like different all-star game or in his family room or at his dorm room you know what i mean you can really why did a podcast interview with you from your office for 45 minutes. I mean, that wasn't impossible five, six years ago. Yeah, so I think we've really, me personally, I've learned a lot from it, and our guys do a great job. I learned a lot from those interviews, and our guys do a great job of asking the pertinent questions, not like, you know, it's your favorite color. Well, I just, as a football fan, it was really enjoyable to watch you guys come together and play, and that was, you know, there's something just like, something about a team that no one really saw coming, even though you'd won 10 games a year before. Yeah. You know, it's not like you were like a three-win team. Yeah, we were under the radar. Yeah, I thought it was crazy. You should have put some cash down. I did, 5-1. Did you really? I did because it was like the Rams last year had won 10. It wasn't that big of a difference. Yeah. And then watching you guys get hot and, I mean, that Super Bowl, that was pretty cool. Yeah, that was a blast, man. That was pretty cool. So congratulations. I appreciate you, John. Enjoy the week. Thanks for having me, man. Today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor, Hard Rock Bet, Florida's sportsbook. I know it's tough when no football makes me sad. But like the song says, I bet I will survive. With Hard Rock Bet, there's always something every single night. Hoops, hockey, so much more. Plus, all the great same-game parlay, live betting, and player prop options you're used to. And did you know that Hard Rock Bet is the official sports betting partner of the Miami Heat and the Orlando Magic? So they know their basketball. Hard Rock Bet app is the only legal sports book whenever you're in Florida. So if you live in Arizona, Ohio, New Jersey, Indiana, Tennessee, Virginia, Illinois, Colorado, and Michigan, come to states near you as well. If you haven't signed up for Hard Rock Bet yet, there's never been a better time. New signups can double their winnings on their first 10 bets. Max 50 bucks. That's right. If you would have won 100 bucks on your bet, you make $200. Plus, Hard Rock Bet offers new promos daily. Download the Hard Rock Bet app and make your first deposit today. Payable and bonus bets, not a cash offer. Offered by Seminole Tribe of Florida in Florida. Offered by Seminole Hard Rock Digital, LLC and all other states. You must be 21 plus and physically present in Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Illinois, Indiana, Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, and Virginia to play. Terms and conditions apply. Concerned about gambling? In Florida, call 1-833-PLAYWISE. In Indiana, if you or someone you know has a gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800-9-WITH-IT. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER. Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. In 2023, a story gripped the UK, evoking horror and disbelief. A nurse who should have been in charge of caring for tiny babies is now the most prolific child killer in modern British history. Everyone thought they knew how it ended. A verdict, a villain, a nurse named Lucy Letby. Lucy Letby has been found guilty. But what if we didn't get the whole story? The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapses. I'm Amanda Knox and in the new podcast Doubt the case of Lucy Letby we follow the evidence and hear from the people that lived it to ask what really happened when the world decided who Lucy Letby was. No voicing of any skepticism or doubt It'll cause so much harm at every single level of the British establishment of this is wrong Listen to Doubt the case of Lucy Letby on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car When you look at your car you going to become overwhelmed with such good feelings Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused. Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. NLP, aka Neuro Linguistic Programming, is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics, and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain. It's about engineering consciousness. Mind Games is the story of NLP. Its crazy cast of disciples and the fake doctor who invented it at a New Age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all? NLP might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him. But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question, of his life. And that's a unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to The Sixth Bureau on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. okay let's let's dive into matt money smith okay very excited uh we actually played golf i think last year uh matt money smith biggest radio show southern cal i mean the dodgers pretty good uh pretty good team to be in business with yeah am 570 in los angeles with one of my favorites petros which we'll dive into he had a pretty legendary rant and uh we played golf we played a par three me you and daniel jeremiah who you are the play-by-play guy for the sandy or it's all right los angeles chargers 10th year uh isn't that wild and you came over from the lakers i worked for the lakers for five years uh and then i did national nfl and ncaa football calls and then when the chargers moved to la in 17 they hired me i'm always fascinated by guys like you who do the play-by-play guy who's a play-by-play guy for a massive team but also has a radio show where it's a completely different world is it ever hard to kind of flip back and forth yeah a little bit um we do a stupid show you know you're familiar with it so it can get you into a little bit it's like howard stern sports kind of little bit yeah i mean i think that's we so like we were syndicated for three years and we hated it because it was just when you're syndicated it's like hey here's story one here's story two here's story and that's just not us and so we might be the only show in the history of sports radio that was like hey we're not doing this anymore and they're like wait what do you mean you're not you're not no we want to be an LA show and just talk about Los Angeles and our experience you know we love the city I moved there you know for college I went to Pepperdine when I was 17 so I've been there for 35 years now 34 years now um so it's Petros from LA Born and raised on the hill, San Pedro, Palos Verdes, obviously San Pedro High School, Peninsula High, USC. Been just there the whole time. I met my wife there. She's a local. She's from Huntington Beach. So it's just a special place. And we like having a local show. You know the thing, I grew up loving radio. I remember the first time being in junior high and Jim Rome. And this is late 90s. Nothing like that existed. Yeah. And I got worked in football for a little bit, but radio is something. I think it was an easy transition because I was a listener my whole life. My dad, you know, up in Northern California, KNBR. Yeah. He's a sports leader. I never got in his truck. You know, he was a farmer driver without that being on. Right. Or anyone, all the people he worked with, that was just, it was a staple. But radio in Northern California, not quite the same. Yeah. You guys are still having a lot of success. How is that possible? Especially in a market like the West Coast can be a little like, you know, people just get distracted it's just easier to get distracted uh the the car right we connect to our phones right how have you guys kind of maintained success because clearly you have i appreciate it yeah it's um i think you you you described it perfectly you develop relationships um i'm old now man you can see it on my face it's leathered and you look good um so i i now meet people who who are in their 30s that tell me they were, you know, in middle school when their dad picked them up at school, and they would listen to Petros and Money on their way home, and it was a connection that they had with their dad. And, like, I've now met people that have 10-year-old sons that were the sons that now listen, oh, yeah, and this is something my son and I have together. So I think that's how you survive it, is this is our 20th year. We're the longest-running show that's still intact. John and Ken, which is on KFI. It's a conservative talk. Ken is retired, so there's just John now, but that's it. It's so far and away the longest-running sports show in L.A. that stayed in the afternoon drive slot, and I think that's it. You just, you know, I think it's like you with your audience, right? You engage with your people that are commenting, and they feel like you're with them. Like, oh, yeah, they're in the car with me. And because L.A. is a car culture, I think that helps a lot. Even with the phone, you can still, and the other thing, not to make, this is probably pretty boring for everybody, but like we got into podcasting early. We told iHeart before there was an iHeartRadio, hey, we need to, where can we post this? How can we get this on Apple Music? How can we get this on iTunes to be able to podcast? Because we're going to lose audience if we don't. So we've been podcasting for a long time. I've been in business with iHeart, you know, with Colin and everything. and they are, you know, for probably traditional 20 years ago, more radio-based, have transitioned pretty well to the digital, like pretty, you know, some of these quote-unquote legacy companies struggle making the pivot. They pivoted pretty well, which I sure helps being involved with them. Yeah, I mean, perfectly. So I came up in music originally. I was in music the first, you know, while also doing a little bit of sports, not that bore people, but I worked for K-Rock, arguably. I was the music director at K-Rock. I was on the morning show at K-Rock. It's arguably the biggest station in America at the time, and they did not have the vision. Was that rock? So it was KROQ, so it's alt-rock, so basically breaking bands like Depeche Mode, The Cure, Nirvana, Sublime, you know, that sort of stuff. Red Hot Chili Peppers. Red Hot Chili Peppers, all of that stuff was KROQ, and they didn't have that vision. And now when you look at, if you want to stream KROQ live, stream it from the iHeartRadio app. Even though they're competitive companies, even though they're Odyssey and it's iHeart here, it's still, which is why you and Colin are in a great spot and so many people can access your content, iHeart's just like, whatever, man, come on over here. We'll run your stream and we'll make money off it and we'll throw some commercials in there and we'll be good. When I first got into radio after football in like 2013-14, I was on the smaller station in the Bay Area, 95-7, going up against KNBR. At the time, the Giants had won two World Series and then in 14 they won another one. and I remember we'd get the ratings books, and we were doing pretty well. But when that team started taking – they were doing like 20 shares. Yeah. In a market that's – I mean, San Francisco is not quite L.A., but it's one of the biggest markets in America in KMBR's reach. You guys have the Dodgers who are now – you know, I was a little young for like the Magic Johnson, Pat Riley, who just took the country by storm. Yeah. Does feel – you know, and baseball is not quite the same of what it was, but that team feels like they've broken through and almost feels like an NFL team. You couldn't find a casual sports fan that wouldn't have an opinion right now on the Los Angeles, which is great for business. It is. And you're in the business with that. You go to games. I do, yeah. I remember talking to you on the golf course about how dialed in these guys are from a character standpoint. They're an impressive operation that has a lot of money. Yeah, we go to games because we broadcast from the games. We'll do our radio show because we go into Dodger baseball. So pre-game's at 6. We're on 3 to 7. We get that last hour preempted. So we'll just do the show from the stadium, wireless mics, on the field. We know all the players. That's pretty cool. It's really cool. It's not pretty cool. It's really cool because they're good guys. And sort of one of the more viral social media conversations we had, we were talking to Andrew Friedman, and we brought up, I think the way we phrased the question was, you know, people saying that you just spend all this money feel like it short changes you know scouting the work the players put it and he just lit up he's like it was like and it wasn't something that i pre-planned or anything he was just almost like a oh thank you for asking me that he said and he did not hold back man um i think it was during a padre series so you got a little bit of a salty vibe already going there and he said look right behind me right now what do you see he's like There's Freddie Freeman digging out, you know, with Dino Ebel just working on digs. He's like, do you see Mookie Betts out here? Mookie Betts was out here two hours ago fielding grounders at shortstops. That's Mookie Betts and Freddie Freeman. That's every one of our players. Look on that sideline. Look over there on that baseline. What do you see? Nobody's there. He's like, these guys bust their ass. He goes, you run the, they're only winning because they're getting paid and they're paying all this money. He said it's insulting to these guys because of how professional they are and how hard they work. And that's what they've done an incredible job of is they put together a team and they didn't pay anyone until Mookie. They're like, Mookie's one of those guys, man, who's just so hyper-focused on being the greatest ever. And Freddie's the same way and Shohei's the same way and Yamamoto with his javelins and all of that. They're like, yeah, we'll give you guys hundreds of millions of dollars, but we won't give it to everyone. If you took Jim Harbaugh to a pregame and you said you get to pick one guy to try to make a football player, Would he pick Mookie or could he pick Otani? He'd pick Otani. He would. Otani's huge. Like, you don't realize it until he walks out. You know, a lot of times we're just kind of leaning on the railing of the dugout, and here's where the guys are walking out right next to you. So you're level with them, right? And for the most, like, you know, that's what's cool about baseball is Mookie's slightly larger than me, and I'm not a big guy, obviously. You know, whereas, like, I remember David Eckstein for the Angels, smaller than me, and yet here's an ALCS MVP, right? Dustin Pedroia, who I grew up close to in Woodland, California, was like 5'8". Right. Won the MVP. Right. Won an MVP. You can do that, and then all of a sudden you see Aaron Judge or like Shohei Eltoni emerge from the dugout, and you're like, oh, my God. Like, look how broad he is. Look at how thick his trunk is. Like, then you see that, and it's like, okay, now that's a football player. I remember it was like Sunday Night Baseball, his first year for the Angels, and he hit like a ball off the wall, and I remember him rounding for – Because you didn't know. You just do this guy, this, like, all-time talent from Japan. But we've had that before. And he rounded first, and it was like, holy shit, look at him run. Right. You know, because we've had some big boppers from Japan. But the athletic ability, like, I mean, what would his 40 time be? Probably 4'5"? It'd be ridiculous. Yeah. That size. And then just kind of thinking about, you know, the arms. Like, the idea of dropping Shohei into a quarterback clinic for, you know, two years or something, like, he's built like Herbert. You know, he's that big. You know, you think about Justin Herbert who's probably, you know, between he and I think maybe even more so just from a muscular standpoint than Josh Allen, I think you'd probably point to Herbert as, hey, what's the best stature, best body QB in the NFL? And it's probably Justin. And, like, that's who he reminds me of. Well, let's talk about the Chargers. Yeah. How long have you been doing their games? Ten years. This is my tenth year. So you did it before they moved to Los Angeles? I did it the year they moved. It's crazy to think they've been in L.A. this will be their 10th year in Los Angeles. Isn't that insane? 10 years? 2017. Yeah, 2017. So you were doing the games at the Home Depot Center? Home Depot Center. What was that like? Coolest thing ever. Like, it sucked with the fans because it was such a small, premium-priced experience, so you're spending pretty much $300 on every ticket. How many people were in there? 24,000. That's pretty cool. It was incredible. Like, we're calling the games. It's like a high school stadium. Yeah. calling games at the top of the first section and that's it that's the top and then on the opposite side you actually have an upper deck that was it I told so many people friends of mine that are scattered around the country I was like do yourself a favor fly to LA go to one of these games it'll never happen again like it'll never happen again you can hear like from our broadcast booth you could hear rivers yelling at the refs you could hear the opposite sideline at times screaming at each other like it was so intimate it was really really cool but it was terrible for the team how really quick how cool was the philip rivers moment this year the best that moment on monday night football i know they lost but he was slinging it around it's just i said this about sam darnold the hockey team we just don't get that many genuine moments anymore so it's listen the media i'm part of it you're part of it some of it's just like we talk too much about stuff that was just like pure and cool this 45 year old guy probably weighed 280 pounds oh yeah just come back knew the offense because he'd been calling it, his passion and pride, him getting hit. It's just like, what a badass. How cool would it have been to have been on his high school team? They showed the video of all those kids watching. What a moment. You know, for his own family, some of those kids that were younger, don't remember. He's the best guy. He's the best guy. I know that he's got a bit of a polarizing personality, especially if you're a Raider or a Bronco fan. I think since he's retired, they recognize that there's only one Phillip Rivers, man. You don't make him like that. the guy that cared so much, that was willing to get emotional about how much he cared. You talk to his teammates, it'll be interesting. I think he seriously considered that Bill's job, and I think they seriously considered him. I don't think that was a joke. I think he and Josh Allen really hit it off, and that was something that they were very serious about, just because he's that kind of guy. And so I think when he takes his job, it's going to be fun to see how many of his former teammates he puts on his staff because of just the respect they have. Like, you know, we have Nick Hardwick as our assistant OL coach, his former center. Like, I have no doubt he'll be like, where do you want me? I'm there. Were you there with – was Kenny Wiggins on the team? Remember that offensive lineman? He's a Fresno State guy. Yeah. He – Trying to think if he was. He might have been like 15, 16, 17 maybe right before he got there. Yeah, I think he was right before us. Might have been San Diego. But he – when I was a GA at Fresno State, he was our tackle. And I remember texting with him, and he's like, I can't tell you how much I love Phillip Rivers. And it was just, I've said forever, what John Madden had, and even Gruden, like you can't fake that. Like people kind of try. It's like they're just unique personalities. I think Rivers, I'm glad. Like if you're going to be a head coach, that's cool because you're part of our lives. I think he could be a John Madden, John Gruden. He would be a rock star. I believe the money that Amazon threw at him was ridiculous. Oh, they tried to get him. Oh, yeah. That it was ridiculous. And, like, the accommodations that they were going to make for him, ridiculous. And just to speak to the kind of guy he is, he's like, gosh darn it, I'd be shortchanging my guys. You know, I appreciate you getting me back from games on Friday, but I don't want to shortchange my guys being gone on Wednesday afternoon to Thursday night. They're like, well, Charter, you're playing back right after the game Thursday. You'll be home, you know, middle of the night. On Thursday you'll be good. Nah, shortchange them kids. Can't do it. That the kind of guy he is man for like million a year What clear though then is coming back and coaching the high school he gotten the juice to coach Because you take a head coaching so that maybe he not going to do the John Madden thing and he's more likely to do the Andy Reid thing. I think so. I think so. Would you say the next five years he's a head coach in the NFL? I wouldn't be surprised if he's a head coach. NFL, yeah, I could see it. I wouldn't be surprised if he's a head coach at NC State next year. His son just committed. I saw him the ticker. Yeah, I mean, I could see that. If you're NC State, you want to have relevance. It's a state with money. You know, you need people to scratch out checks. You're going to write a check to Phillip Rivers. How sick would that be, Phillip Rivers, the coach, and his son, the quarterback? They're like, we'll put Belichick on all these guys. No, Phillip Rivers is – What was Kenny Dillingham's famous line? Can somebody stroke me a check for 20 minutes? Phillip Rivers will get someone to stroke a $20 million check. You know, people made fun of Kenny Dillingham. I love Kenny. Someone gave him a check. He got money. He said on an interview the other day – I love Kenny. Like a guy that wasn't even associated with Arizona State, but a rich guy in Scottsdale gave him a bunch of money, and they're building the thing. Good for that, man. I told my wife, it worked. Yeah, it's just such a great line. You mean to tell me there's not someone to stroke a $20 million? I don't know. Maybe you're traveling in circles, and I'm not. It does seem like it'd be kind of hard, but Kenny's awesome. Okay, you talked about Herbert. You've seen all these games. I've always supported him. He's an easy guy to root for. The playoff games, I mean, this year he has a broken hand. The offensive line's hard, but he's played three playoff games and hasn't gone well. I always say, people forget. Peyton Manning, like when I was young in high school and college, everyone said he was better than Tom Brady. But then the playoffs would start, and Peyton Manning would be atrocious. A lot of people, I watched the Elway doc. He had, I mean, in the Super Bowl against the 49ers. Now, granted, they're like the greatest team of all time. He threw for like 100 yards. It was like 9 of 40. So it's like guys have bad games. He's young. I would take it you and DJ and all these guys around him think that, and Jim Harbaugh, most importantly, like they ain't selling stock. No, no. But why has it happened? Well, I think this year I think was different than last year. Last year I don't think he had a chance. There was no chance. Will Anderson and Daniel Hunter and all those guys were in his lap every time he took a snap. Like there was just even the tackles. Slater and Ault were out there, and even they were getting gas. Will Anderson's a problem. Exactly. He was a huge. So for me, like that one was different. This year I think that so much scar tissue had built up over the year where there's just unblocked rushers, there's quick pressures, that by the time that playoff game came around, it was just... Basically, the success of the offense was him operating out of structure. That was it. It wasn't really anything else. Him against the Eagles was... Him running around. Yeah. He was like, I'm just going to pull it and run. It wasn't a play call. He's just pulling it and running it because nothing else is working because he can't get blocks. He has no time in the pocket. He's wearing it. He's getting hit. God knows how many times. So I think it just caught up to him in New England. And I don't think, and I like Greg Roman a lot. I know this is what people do, right, when they're about to say something bad. But Greg's a great guy. I just thought the game plan was very curious. It's like, you know you can gash these guys on the edges with a run game, and yet they never ran it. Like, they just got that turnover, first and goal from the 10. And what is it? It's three runs by Justin Herbert. It's like, what? Run to the edges, you know. You've got this Trevor Penny as your 6-0 lineman, Tucker Fisk as your tight end. Go beat them up. And they just never did it. So I think that game got into his head, and he missed some throws. He wasn't good. He had a bad game. No, but they weren't. Defensively, they were sensational. Offensively, they weren't good, and I think that's what makes this year so interesting. What's weird about Roman is historically back to his 49er days with Harbaugh, then with Harbaugh's brother in Baltimore, is a run game guy. And then this year, before the injuries really took all, they were passing all the time. Do you think he was trying to prove, like, I'm a pass guy, or was it just trying to write? I think, unfortunately, it happens. It happens, and I think that's what I credit Harbaugh and the way that he's coached his teams is he's always been so good about it. He's like, I don't care. I'm going to run with a tight end who's got his hand on the ground. I'm going to run with a fullback. I'm going to run power, God's play, and guess what? You're not even going to pass in the second half, J.J. McCarthy. We're going to beat Penn State by running the ball, and I don't care if that doesn't lead to celebration and sports center highlights. That's not what I'm here for. So I think it's just very hard for OCs, especially in the era of Kyle Shanahan and Sean McVay and Mike McDaniel and all of this eye candy. It's very hard for them to just be a power team. I think I saw a clip, maybe Mike McDaniel's first or second day, you were sitting down with him. What's your thought of? Just the Mike experience so far. Yeah, he's a really cool guy, man. He's a very thoughtful, interesting guy. You ask him a question, and it's not dismissive. It's very thoughtful about, you know, and I think that just kind of speaks to how into football he is. I think he and Jim are a lot more similar than people think. You know, they're just different about it. Jim. They look different. They look different, yeah. You know, I think Jim loves, I think Coach Harbaugh loves the physicality of football, the idea of ultimately what is football. Football is preventing forward progress. It's what it is. This guy's trying to go here. You're trying to make sure he doesn't, and I think Jim loves that. Whereas I think Mike McDaniel is, he gave a great answer. I think it was in that interview. I don't remember if it was at the presser or if it was with us, but I'd never heard someone say it before, and maybe you have, but it was so, it crystallized it. He said, the defense is trying to guess the answer to your question. As an offensive coordinator, I'm delivering a question, and they're trying to answer it, and I've got to devise the hardest question for them to answer. And it's just such a great way to think about pre-snap motion, different formations, using players like Darren Waller was talking about, putting a slot receiver in the backfield, because now the question is more complex. It's not the same. And so I think when you have someone that's thought about football and thinks about football that way, like, I need to make this as hard on them as possible. And Harbaugh's the same way. I need to make this as hard as them as possible. I think people, when they look at Mike, you know, he's this nerdy Ivy League guy. His football career really took off, and he's even said this, is he's with Kyle and that whole crew, and he realizes these guys, like, I've got to find a niche for these guys. So he got with Chris Forrester, who's Kyle's O-line coach, and learned the run game and blocking. That's kind of his bread and butter. Like if you talk to Juszczyk or Kittle, they swear by the guy. So when you say he's a lot like Jim Harbaugh, when Jim Harbaugh said we took Joe Ault because he's the tip of the spear, people were like, he's a weapon. They were like, well, no, weapons are Malik neighbors. And Harbaugh's like, no, weapons are my tackles, my guards, my centers. I think Mike thinks more like that than people. I think the Miami thing is like throwing people off the scent a little bit. I'm with you, man. Ultimately, and to that, Matt, you know, to that, think about Sean McVay. Sean McVay's a run guy. Like, it's outside zone, man. That is the foundation of the Rams offense. It's Todd Gurley. This last year, it's Kyron Williams, man. And you look at the way he's now drafted offensive linemen. He's kind of even gone from those smaller, more athletic guys like Mike McDaniel had in Miami to he's got freaking beef on that line now. And they're starting to run a little bit more power. So I do think that, and I mean, my gosh, look at Kyle in San Francisco, right? Kyle would run at every play. Kyle is like a skinnier, younger version of Jim. Right. You know? Like, that's what people, I think, forget. Because the eye candy is pretty cool, and the explosives are pretty cool. But when you boil it down, they're run guys. Is that a Chargers deficiency right now, some skill guys? I mean, biased, not selfishly, but with my bias, no. I really like the room. I think Lad's a legitimate number one receiver. he could end up with Jalen Waddell, like 1,700-yard, eight-touchdown season. It wouldn't surprise me at all. Do you think he's that good? He is. He's so good. He's so good in the open field. He always whips out of catches. Look at a guy like J.S. Yeah, he'll whip out of catches and get you an extra 10 yards every single time, and he's become so proficient at finding soft spots in zones now. Before it was a lot of just man-beater. He'll just be – you've got no chance, man. He's going to shake you. and that's when he whips out and he's getting those extra 10 yards. Now he's, last year we saw him start to settle into zones and kind of feel it out a little bit more. So I think he could have a sensational year. And second year guy, doesn't have a lot of stats. Nobody would know him unless you follow the Chargers. Trey Harris, he's going to be special. Ole Misskit. Yeah, he's going to be special, man. He blocks his tail off, man. He will block like a mother effer. And the players love him. He's crazy smart, like stupid smart when you talk to him. former quarterback was Malik Nabors quarterback in high school and probably a decent high school team right quit to play basketball because he thought he was getting recruited to play ball Malik Nabors came to him and said we can win the state championship but I need you can you come back and essentially sold him on the idea of I need you too man like I'm gonna get recruited I don't play basketball and so that's like selfless sort of behavior too and I think that speaks to why here's a guy who was an axe at Ole Miss and now he's just being asked to block his ass off every time he's on the field he's got like 15 targets through eight games and yet he's crushing dudes in the run game I think it speaks to the type of player he is so I say all of that to get to I think he's gonna have a big year because I think McDaniel's gonna love him one thing by the time before Harbaugh and Ortiz got there it felt like the synergy with you know Tom and Staley just was a little off and then now I was just getting a breakfast sandwich this morning behind Joe Ortiz And it feels like Joe Ortiz and Jim Harbaugh, you know, the successful teams, you know, Veach, Andy. Yeah. Right. I mean, Kyle John Lynch, McVay, Les. You've got to have some synergy with those two guys. Yeah. And it does feel like a pretty good relationship because Jim, he's mellowed out a lot. You know, he's a different guy now than he was 15 years ago, probably 10 years ago. He's actually kind of come into his own, I feel like. Yeah. Just very comfortable. And the chip on his shoulder is still there, but he doesn't show it as much. It feels like they got a pretty good thing going, those two, which is important. And the only way you can have sustained success, even if you're as good of a coach as Jim, we saw at the end with Trent Baalke, you around these guys, what's like your takeaway for the couple of years being around those two? Yeah, I think the key with GMs is, and I thought Tom was really good at this too, you know, with different types of coaches. You know, when I was there, Anthony Lynn was the first coach, and then it was Brandon Staley, and they both were very different. And I thought Tom Telesco worked very close with them too. not just oh I'm going to pick the best guy and he's going to be a pro bowler and it's going to look good for me I need to draft the right guy for my team and I think Joe and Jim have a very special relationship like that of yeah I'm going to draft the guy that you know I think is going to a be the best player over the next four years or five years that's what you're drafting them for not just this year and be someone that has a chance to thrive that that is going to fit in with this group that has the right character, makeup, style of play, physicality. It's a physical team. You've got to be able to kick some ass to be a Charger. When you look up Tule, Khalil Mack, these guys are physical. T.R. Tart is mean as hell. Same thing with Joe for his baby face. He's nasty. Alt is a nasty. And Rashawn Slater is nasty, as smart as he is. These are nasty dudes, man. And so I think Joe has done a really good job of drafting. And I think Ladd McConkie, low-key, is that chip on the shoulder. Okay, I'm a little white guy with curly hair, and I got my little southern accent, and you think I'm a cute guy. No, man. He wants to kick you out. Remember, guys, I played at Georgia, the best team in the country, for multiple years. I was the best receiver on the team. Right with Brock Bowers, like we were the two guys. Yeah. Remember when we left and the team fell apart? Like, that was me. Yeah. So I think he does a great job of drafting guys like that. In 2023, a story gripped the UK, evoking horror and disbelief. The nurse who should have been in charge of caring for tiny babies is now the most prolific child killer in modern British history. Everyone thought they knew how it ended. A verdict, a villain, a nurse named Lucy Letby. Lucy Letby has been found guilty. But what if we didn't get the whole story? The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapses. I'm Amanda Knox and in the new podcast Doubt the Case of Lucy Letby we follow the evidence and hear from the people that lived it to ask what really happened when the world decided who Lucy Letby was No voicing of any skepticism or doubt It'll cause so much harm at every single level if the British establishment of this is wrong Listen to Doubt the Case of Lucy Letby on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car? When you look at your car, you're going to become overwhelmed with such good feelings. Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you? I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused. Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. NLP, a.k.a. Neuro Linguistic Programming, is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics, and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain. It's about engineering consciousness. Mind Games is the story of NLP, its crazy cast of disciples, and the fake doctor who invented it at a New Age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all? NLP might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him. But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question, of his life. And that's a unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS, and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to The Sixth Bureau on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's Khalil Mack's a free agent, right? I would imagine they like Khalil Mack a lot. Yes, they love him. He's a little older, but... He's a tone setter. tone setter, had a great conversation with corner Tarheep Still, who was going in at just finished his rookie year. And he had mentioned that he was coming into the facility to work out. And Khalil was there. And he's like, yeah, it was cool. You know, I started talking to Khalil and he was sort of helping me out, getting me on a on a path. And then I came in. It's like, it was like a Tuesday. I came in on Thursday and I was like, where were you yesterday? He's like, oh, you know, I'm doing Tuesday, Thursday, Friday right now. He's like, OK. He's like, And I got the hint real quick. He's like, and yeah, ever since then, I've been coming in seven days a week. And I meet Khalil, and we work out together. And that's, you want to know how you can be 34 going on 35, and you're still one of the top 10 all-around edge players. Well, he's got like Schwarzenegger 85 biceps. Right. I mean, they are huge. And that's kind of going back to our Dodger conversation. Khalil puts in the work, man. And he now like I think Thule 23 going into his fourth year 24 I think he going to be 24 Talk about having a guy to guide you And Thule was probably the most underrated D man in the league last year Guy had 13.5 sacks, man, and countless pressures. He's top 10 in pressures. Can play inside, kick outside. That NASCAR package with Thule on the inside and Mack and Owe on the outside at a 55% pressure rate. Jeez. That's all Khalil Mack. That's him setting the tone. So you'd expect them to be pretty aggressive trying to bring him back. I think it's what's the number? Can we make it work? We've got to re-sign O-Way. We've probably got to do an extension for Thule so he doesn't get the free agency next year. Can we make that work? And I think Khalil, he loves Southern California, man. I see his kids running around the field all the time. There are certain guys that don't like it and want to go back to Kansas and climb in their truck and go hunting and stuff like that because that's what they're into, or go back to Florida because that's what they're into. I get the sense Khalil really likes Southern California. I feel like Khalil could be a movie star. You know, like Howie Long when he did Broken Arrow? He's such a good-looking guy. He's enormous. Yep. Got the Schwarzenegger, Howie Long thing going. It's a great call. I mean, I feel like Khalil Mack. It's a great call. Movies have changed. The action movies don't happen as much. But if this was the heyday of, like, 95, I feel like Khalil Mack would, like, have a machine gun. Relaunch Commando or something. I'll be kicking everyone's ass. Absolutely. I'll get you out of here on this. You know, I think the Chargers are going to be a sexy, obviously free agency in the draft. Yeah. I think there's going to be a lot of momentum going into the season. You know, the Super Bowl is at SoFi. Harbaugh, third year, kind of really established his group. I think they're going to be a team that a lot of people, the division's hard. I mean, the Raiders are surely going to be a little better, you think. And Denver and Kansas City are kind of an outlier, six-win team. They're tough. What's the key to figuring it out and getting over the hump? Well, I think it's offense, which is why the McDaniel hire is so exciting. You look at the Patriots game, they allowed 16 points. You've got to win a playoff game when you allow 16 points. You think about that Denver game in Week 18, they had all backups. playing defense, and they didn't allow a touchdown. And it's a team that was fighting for the number one seed, and they did not allow a touchdown. So I feel great about the defense, even though Jesse's gone, and I think the world of Jesse, I think he's going to be exceptional in Baltimore. I ran into him the other day. He is not big. No. If you didn't know who he was, you would never think that's the new head coach of the Baltimore Ravens. And he looks very young. He's got a very young face. He's so smart. His pressers, I used to, not a big press conference guy. It's a lot of platitudes and non-answer answers. Jesse was always great, man. Very thoughtful, articulate, answered with, yeah, we did that wrong. We should have done this. I could do this better. So he's going to be great. So you're going to lose a lot. Who's their defensive coordinator? It's Chris O'Leary. So Chris was, so it was interesting because we thought they would go in-house just to try to keep the continuity, keep as many of the coaches in-house as they could, which they did. Chris was the safety's coach in year one of Harbaugh. So came from Notre Dame. 2024 was his only year coaching in the NFL, coach safeties. So he's the one that was tasked with getting Derwin right. Like, hey, this is how I think we're going to play you. We're going to predominantly feature you as a slot corner, as a big nickel. We're going to play in some dime linebackers. So he basically was tasked with, let's make sure Derwin, what was his line? It was clarity is velocity. That was Chris O'Leary's line. clarity is velocity and I need Derwin to play with velocity so I need to get this to be easy and clear so he can be the best version of himself which is in the conversations the best like Kyle Hamilton in Baltimore so he did that they traded for Elijah Molden I think middle of training camp and it was on O'Leary to get him ready for the season and Molden had a huge year playing free safety for them and so I think those two things combined with he goes to western Michigan to be their D.C. He was not on the team last year. He takes the Bronx from, I think they were 115th defense in the nation. And remember, this is the MAAC. You're not spending a bunch of money to get a bunch of great players in. It's pretty much level. So me and you's on defense. Yeah. So it's like you might as well, you're at Ohio or you're at Toledo or you're at Western or Central Michigan. It's all equal, you know, for the most part. Top 10. Top 10 defense. and all he did, and it was funny when you looked at his game plans and his teaching sheets, they were all Chargers. They just put a little Western Michigan logo on there. So basically he's just a disciple of Jesse Minner and a great, again, very smart guy. So as long as – it's a really long answer. As long as that holds up. They're going to be good. They're going to be good, man. I think the offense is going to be good. I think the Harbaugh brothers, and Jim's talked about this forever, their ability to hire coaches. That's it. Especially defensive coaches is pretty good. I mean, no one 10 years ago, Mike McDonald, I mean, the guy was a quality control guy at Georgia, and they've turned him into, I mean. One of the best coaches in the league. Kyle Shanahan or Sean McVay of defense. Right. So in Harbaugh, you've got to trust because it typically works. And your floor, the thing with Jim, your floor is so high. It's like you're disappointed back-to-back playoffs, no problem. Right. You know, so. You're going to get in. And if you can get into the tournament when you've got Herbert, I know he has not played well, anything can happen. And, you know, I can make excuses forever about those playoff games and just sort of the issues that were plaguing them. Even the Jacksonville game, man, they just – I mean, I can do it. How are you running a freaking reverse to Michael Bandy when you're shutting the Jacksonville Jaguars out and all you need is a yard and a half to pick up a first down and go to the half? Up 28-0, and it's over. And instead, Joe Lombardi's running a freaking reverse with a practice squad guy who bobbles the snap and turns it over. Jacksonville scores, and it felt completely different going into the half because of that. It's like, what are we doing? I got one more question, actually. SC football, your co-host Petros. People might not remember, played at USC. Captain of the worst football team in USC history. And he says that. I don't. That's his line. Yes, I was the captain. although I believe it has since been surpassed in one of those Clay Hilton years. You remember in like 06 or 05, Fresno State played USC. I remember it well. Petros called that game. My cousin was a long snapper on that team. I remember it was on TNT back then. But USC in the heyday of Pete, is it fair to say Dodger, Laker level buzz in that city? Yeah, we had no football team. We had no NFL team. Would it have mattered, though, as good as they were? I think they still would have been. Yeah, USC football is a big deal. USC football is a big deal in Southern California. I think bad leadership is ultimately what it came down to. Pete, I think it started with Pete. And a lot of this is me just regurgitating sort of what Petros' views are. But Pete, I think, became jealous of Norm Chow. And, you know, he was getting a lot of the credit. You know, Norm is this great play caller. And he's got Matt Leiner and Reggie Bush. And look what he's doing with Lendale White and Mike Williams. And he just kind of basically kicked him out, you know, and made Lane and Sark and these young guys kind of came in, did the same thing with Dwayne Walker on defense, who was really good at coordinating the defense. And then when he left, it just got away from him, man. Like, instead of recognizing that, hey, you've got all the recruits, you've got an incredible base, they were like, let's just keep the Pete thing going, you know, and so you hire Lane and then you hire Sark. Like, they hired, allegedly, reportedly, I want to make sure I say that, hired a search firm when they hired Sark. They were going to pay a million dollars. It's so stupid what these schools do with these search firms for coaches. What's the 80s job? Right? That's what are you getting paid a million dollars for. So they hire a search firm. Search firm comes back and says, Chris Peterson. No brainer. Perfect guy. they're like okay Steve Sarkeesian Washington's like take him we'll hire Chris Peterson and look at how that worked they went to the playoffs immediately yeah immediately like had USC just listened to the search firm and hired coach Pete I think coach Pete might still be coaching there yeah like it would have gone so well I've said forever in college football like culture and personality and where you're from matter look at all the great west coast coaches Pete California guy yeah jeff tedford california guy chris peterson uc davis west coast guy nick saban kirby smart dabbo sweeney they're from the south they have the draw right the northeast guys now there are some guys urban meyer could have coached on anywhere nick saban probably could have too but most guys are not that yeah and lincoln is a small town texas guy it's not a good took over oklahoma who it was already built by my it was already built by stoops it was a little like now chip with bilotti took it to another level but they were already a top 20 team it was a good job to take over and take the next level. Lincoln did the same. They were already a top 20, top 15 team. He just made them a top five team. USC was a disaster. Yeah. And Lincoln, they thought they could buy their way out of problem. They gave him $120 million. They buy his mansion in Oklahoma. It's been a fucking disaster. It has been. There's no way around it. And then last year he wants out of the LSU game, and Brian Kelly's like, no, we're playing this game. Brian Kelly said that. It's like this guy, everyone's making fun of him, and he's like, no, we're playing. This year, obviously, he's pushing for the Notre Dame thing. I feel like USC has just lost his way, and it kind of starts with, I met him a couple times. He's a nice guy. I just think it's an awful fit. It is. I mean, I think it's a terrible fit. And I just, he has this great recruiting class. Okay, all these 18-year-old guys. You ever hear Rick Pitino talk? High school kids in basketball and football are done. Yeah. Because you don't need them for like three years. Right. So it's like, okay, you have the top recruiting class. And part of it is California law. They could pay these kids in high school. Yeah. Some of these states can't. So they can give them a bonus while they're still in high school. So would the kid actually go to SC? Or is he just going because you gave him $700,000? Yeah, it's like. I'm sure Nessie football this year, I don't see them as a playoff team. No, I'm with you. It's top-down. It's beyond leadership. It's beyond the head coach. And it's beyond Jen Cohen. I think it's all the way to the president of the university, how it's just gotten sideways. The idea that you could let a small-town Texas head coach that's done nothing for your program dictate the end of the most storied college football rivalry outside of Michigan, Ohio State. Like, you're going to really let that go because if Lincoln Riley thinks he can make the playoff, which he has not done yet, if you get rid of USC Notre Dame, McKay, Rockne. Like, that's what we're talking about. You know, for me, a guy that's my age. Liner's defining play in college was not any of the national championships. It was the Notre Dame game with Reggie. Exactly. Right? And, like, so for me, my era, it was Rivers versus Rodney Peet, man. Like, that was the game. Like, that's the greatest college. I remember that being, to me as a kid, like the coolest college football game I ever watched because it was storied Notre Dame, storied USC, the history of those two programs, California versus Chicago, and it's just. Is it done officially? They've tabled it for two years. They could revisit it, but it's just so dumb that it happened. It's so incredibly stupid that they let it happen. I don't understand it. And I know, like, the USC supporters, and there's plenty of them that will, they're just bootlickers. They'll say whatever they can to support the school and the team. Well, Notre Dame doesn't play by the rules, and they need to join a conference, and they don't know what it's like. And it's like, I don't give a damn, man. It's USC-Notre Dame. I don't care. Like, all that stuff you can figure out in the playoff and put pressure on them, and they can't make the playoff unless they carry this sort of – whatever. It's just – I'm just talking about this one game every year, and the idea that it came to an end is asinine, completely asinine. You think Lincoln's the coach in two years? No. No chance. I think he wants out. I think he was – If McGuire – if Texas Tech had not gone well, do you think he's a Texas Tech coach? I think he takes any of those jobs. if anyone from the SEC or the Big 12 come to get him, he will gladly leave. Problem is they're not. No. I think if any of the NFL teams. Like there were some rumors that Tennessee was sniffing around, you know, Sark and sniffing around Lincoln a little bit. I think had they come, gone. See you later. I don't think it's – you're right. Not only is it not a fit for SC, I don't think he believes that. No, that's what I mean. It's his side too. What would they do? We'll end on that. If SC had an opening, what would you even guess? Because it's hard to even, like, I don't even know where they'd start. Like, to me, when it was all coming up, when it all came up, I was like, first person I'd call would probably be Pat Fitzgerald. Get a guy that builds culture. Get the train back on the tracks. Yeah, let's get, what was SC? It was halfback U, man. It's like, let's get this thing back on the tracks. Let's get the trenches right. You've got, like you said, high school players don't matter as much anymore, but they do for depth, you know. Not that they don't, they just don't help you win immediately. Right, exactly. They're not going to help you win immediately. But I think if you get someone like what Pete built with the offensive and defensive lines, when you think about those teams and how good those O-line and D-lines were, man, and when you get sort of like what I think Pat's going to be able to do in the Big Ten again, it's just tough football, man. Chris Peterson does stuff at Fox. He's in L.A. all the time. Oh, I'd hire him in a second. I just don't think he wants to do it. He's done. If Coach Pete said, hey, I want to do it, done, let's go. I think he's one of the most underrated coaches of the last 20 years, 30 years. Genius. Funny, I appreciate it. You got him, man. Enjoy the combine. I will. Enjoy life. I do want to make one correction. When we were together in Phoenix, you played golf. I held clubs and swung them at a little ball. That was the difference. I had a kid about a month and a half ago, and I probably look more like you now swinging this. That's not good for you. So next time you guys come to Arizona, we'll all be equals. Awesome. Talk to you soon, man. Appreciate it, brother. Thanks, bro. Listen to Doubt, The Case of Lucy Letby on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything. I was a monster. Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. Mind Games, a new podcast exploring NLP, a.k.a. neurolinguistic programming. Is it a self-help miracle, a shady hypnosis scam, or both? Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. In 2018, the FBI took down a ring of spies working for China's Ministry of State Security. one of the most mysterious intelligence agencies in the world. The Sixth Bureau podcast is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to The Sixth Bureau on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.