1KHO 701: Charismatic Adults | Dr. Robert Brooks, Raising Resilient Children

Oh, it's a beautiful world Ain't nothing on the screen It's never gonna beat this view Oh, it's a beautiful world And I just wanna share it with, I just wanna share it with you It's a beautiful world Such a beautiful world Oh Spring has a way of filling up the calendar quickly Field trip sports travel co-op which are all good things But they can make it challenging to keep curriculum learning consistent March is really about maintaining momentum while life gets busy That's why having a flexible organized learning tool can make such a difference in the final stretch of the homeschool year IXL is designed to fit into your routine not complicated IXL is an award-winning online learning platform offering interactive practice in math language arts, science and social studies From pre-K through 12th grade It adapts to each child's level, keeps them motivated and gives parents clear visibility into progress What I especially appreciate this time of year is how simple and time-saving it is Everything is organized by grade and subject so you can jump right into Exactly what your child needs whether that's reinforcing a concept before testing Or confidently moving ahead The clear explanations and visible progress markers help kids stay encouraged As they work toward year end goals make an impact on your child's learning Get IXL now and when thousand hours outside listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership When they sign up today at IXL.com slash 1000 hours Visit IXL.com slash 1000 hours to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price Welcome to the 1000 hours outside podcast My name is Ginny Eardrum the founder of 1000 hours outside And I am beyond honored to have such an accomplished guest today You're enthusiastic as in by the way it's contagious Oh okay good I am so enthusiastic because you are so accomplished Dr. Robert Brooks You have co-authored 23 books Okay I started to go through the biography and you have your doctorate from Clark University at training at University of Colorado Medical School Served on the faculty at Harvard, Director of Development of Department of Psychology at McLean Hospital A private psychiatric hospital And in fact one of the first things you did was you were a principal at a school In the locked door unit of the child and adolescent program at McLean Even on television these books have received all sorts of awards You've received all sorts of awards The one I read is finding the calm child within which would really be helpful for any parent I've just kind of some basic parenting principles And also you were consulted into Sesame Street I mean the list is so long Can you take us back because you've been in this work for decades I always am really interested in what changes that you've seen So you start off in this work You're working with kids who are really struggling What changes have you seen kind of since you started your work up until now In terms of how children and families are doing Right Well I'll start a little by telling you since I've been in the field so long The change is even in my whole approach And then we could talk about specific families When I started Ginny it was time when It was almost what they called the medical model And you looked at what was wrong with people So what could happen is parents could come in to see me about their child Who was having problems I'm almost embarrassed to say this I could spend the first hour or two meeting with parents And 99% would be about what's wrong with your child It was almost like the mentality was You know here's the problem How do you fix it And anyway along the way I started to feel that this wasn't the best approach That I was really missing Really about the beauty and strengths of each child And so one of the key changes And not just in my approach In the field of psychology was starting to look Not ignoring problems but starting to look at the strengths that we all have Which got me very interested in the topic of resilience So even during this transition Instead of just asking parents about their kids problems After about 15-20 minutes I would start asking them questions like Now that I've heard about a few of the problems Can you please tell me what you see as your child strengths Their beauty and I use words like that Or something I coined 40 years ago Or their islands of competence You know the particular strengths And in the field of psychology The whole field of positive psychology was also emerging As I was changing my views So a major change for me And a major change I think in the field Was to really look beyond just problems Not ignore them, look beyond them and see what strengths were And this became even more important You know I just the greater stresses on kids From when I started To now You just have to pick up any paper The increase in anxiety and depression One kids and mental health issues Now I don't want it to seem like when I started 45 years ago That there wasn't a lot of pressure There was a lot of pressure then In the 1980s I would get questions about How much screen time should we allow kids to have At that point screen time and television And we face this now but There really is a greater pressure now In terms of of course the internet And all of these things could be very good And also with AI The worries about kids In one sense giving up their own problem solving abilities Having you know AI solve these some of these problems And you know there's just so many more influences on kids Some may be good but some are also much more problematic Then I think when I think back to when I raised my own kids And even my grandkids getting older now It's really I think that kids Are facing greater challenges And again if I believe in the statistics about The greater anxiety and depression They face which even more Is why I believe strongly that we have to think about Okay, what helps kids to be more resilient To be able to solve problems So a quick 10 minute or whatever Overview of the last 45 years of my career Yes, yes, and these are the topics that you're talking about Tenacity and perseverance and empathy And you know how to help your child to worry less Self-discipline resilience So it all is incredibly important Especially in this day and age like you're talking about with AI I loved the phrasing nurturing islands of competence So the book that I read of yours Plus you have incredible articles on your website So the website is called drrabbertbrooks.com And I'll make sure I'll put that link in the show notes so people can go Thank you Each month you put out a new article so I was looking back All the way to 2023 there was an article about what differentiates us from machines And I just thought oh, this is so important like what makes us human So we'll talk about some of that to two Because I think if we can help kids with the parts that make us human It's really going to help us differentiate ourselves in this day of AI So the book I read finding the calm child within Is specifically to help raise resilient children who have disruptive mood Disregulation disorder But what I found was that well a lot of kids are struggling with their emotions Obviously this is more of an extreme case But so many of the parenting philosophies I felt would work for any parent Is I loved the nurturing the islands of competence You said every child has unique strengths that parents must identify and nurture Parents need to create an environment where their child's strengths can flourish offer opportunities for their strengths to shine And you say when these children they face extreme they got these emotional regulation issues They're really you know, they're really struggling with the way that they view themselves Is an interesting day and age though because a lot of time is going to screens And so you could see that a child maybe would grow up And not have had any of their islands of competence nurtured So can you talk to the parent about You know like putting our time in our resources To making sure that we first of all can identify their strengths and then nurture them as well Yes, this is a very important topic And I also I don't know if it was in that sentence or jenny I also often said You have to honor your child's islands of competence Because sometimes the kid's strengths is not necessarily what you would like to see And I'll give you two examples so it becomes real One is about a 13 year old boy who was having a lot of difficulties and He His social skills were not as advanced. He had trouble in school and He didn't like sports and his parents both had backgrounds where they were excellent students they were excellent sports very good social skills And they had a daughter two years older than this son who was just like they were So at one point they actually talked to me about being disappointed in their son Even though they could say that you know, he had these learning problems whatever they would disappoint it And they used words like that So I remember asking them well, what do you see as his strengths and they were little hesitant and finally they said Well, he likes to garden and take care of plants And I thought well at least there's something he likes to do But they said and again, these were well-meaning parents, but misguided anyway They said yeah, but you know Whatever a 13 year old boy shouldn't be interested in that he should be getting good grades And so he did not feel accepted at all and it took a lot of work in therapy for them eventually to accept Their son and actually one of the things it led to is they went to a horticulture show Where he displayed some of the plants and in school the plants some of his plants were in the lobby And they actually started a horticulture's you know club there So that he could really taste success. So that's one taste where they did not honor You know the the strengths of the son the other was a seven year old boy And I'm just going into little detail here. So people realized these concepts relate to real kids seven year old boy and He also he was an anxious kid He was not interested in some things like sports and his parents came to see me Mainly because of the anxiety But what happened was early on the father said you know when my wife was pregnant Without son all I could think about was playing ball you know with him just like I had known with my father And the father I'm condensing this even though it's a longer story the father then said to me You know my son is an interested in sports. So I said well What did you sound interested in when was the last time you saw him happy? And both parents immediately said he loves to paint draw He's only seven but it's pretty good and then father teared up and he said oh But you know the problem is I don't like to draw or paint And I said to the father at that point and very well-meaning person I said you know I have found that sometimes we have to accommodate more to our children's interests Than asking them to accommodate towers He calls me the next day And he said I couldn't stop thinking about your comment of accommodating to our kids passions I used that word too and interest and I just signed my son and me up at one of the here in the Boston one of the museums for an art class And they took an art class together and after the first meeting in the art class the father called me and he was really choked up and he said It was so nice to see my son so happy Doing something and that I was sharing it with him and then he hit it a little he said and I'm not a good artist and my son looked There and he said dad maybe you're holding your pencil the wrong way, you know kidding So those are those moments that why it's important to honor kids' islands of competence Whether it's a horticulture, whether it's art and that doesn't mean again I'll say this throughout that doesn't mean you ignore things if a kid is having problems But what I find is If kids feel they have disappointed us That is one of the strongest feelings There can be and not necessarily in a positive way Because if they feel there's no way that they can really feel loved or accepted Then kids are not going to be very resilient and I'll just add this last point all the research on resilience Jenny shows that resilience is rooted in positive relationships Whether you know first with your parents and then other caregivers And that if there's not at least one or two people during your childhood who believes in you It's much more difficult to be resilient and the late psychologist Julius Segal In one of his articles and he spends his whole life looking at resilience He said it looking at research around the world The kids who make it have during their childhood or adolescence the presence of what he called a charismatic adult I sometimes wish he hadn't used the word charismatic it has different meanings different people But his definition is nothing short of poetic. He says the charismatic adult is an adult from whom a child gather strength And just to end this point We even as adults throughout senior years we all need charismatic adults in our life People who encourage us who believe in us And that and kids need that as well Because I made me emotional oh yeah Well, it is we're talking about you know family relationships and I often ask parents and you know your audience can think about this You know who were the charismatic adults in your life growing up What did they say and do that made them charismatic adults for you? And then I'll add and what are you what are you saying and doing to be a charismatic adult for your child? Well as mentioned before we got on you know I recently spoke in Michigan to educators I'll ask the same thing Who was the teacher you had that was a charismatic adult for you? God that's right and if you're a teacher what are you saying and doing in your classroom? So you become a charismatic adult for your students Yeah, oh to be a person that helps someone else to gather strength. Oh, oh, it's very powerful Yeah First of all brings meaning to our own life to be a charismatic adult. That's right That's right. We make a difference nurture the islands of competence I really like this article that you talked about what makes us human and you're talking about consciousness and empathy I want to talk about empathy next. Yeah, but even the fact that computers are kind of good at everything Like Some of the top songs right now on Apple music are a-i-written songs The computers are good at everything and it is a unique human quality that we have islands of competence They're not good at everything that there's certain things that light us up certain things that let our kids up And it's not all for you know not for oh in in some ways you're like I wish I was good everything But it sees unique parts that make us human and so you are giving this charge that you have to identify nurture and honor the unique strengths that your child has I'm glad the word honor was in there. So I always That's why I was just talking about honoring. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Yeah. Yeah. 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Get up to 50% off your first monthly crate at KiwiCo.com Code 1000 hours. That's up to 50% off your first crate at KiwiCo.com Code 1000 hours panda crate is an exception seasite for details So then empathy is a part that you talk about a lot too empathy is the cornerstone of emotional resilience Obviously the studies are saying that empathy is dropping this has to do a lot with the screens and the sort of selfie generation Can you talk about why it's important? It seems kind of like a soft skill and it shouldn't really matter But it does matter and then how do we nurture that in our families? Yes And probably every book I've written and many of my articles about resilience in the books There's a chapter in empathy and the reason it's in there is it's such an important skill that we have to really develop in our ourselves Daniel Goldman now, god, it's about 30 years ago. He wrote a book Janik his psychologist called emotional intelligence and in that book he basically said Sometimes more important than IQ is emotional intelligence and one of the key components of emotional intelligence is empathy And what empathy is I mean most of the viewers viewers will know Not totally simplified as the capacity to put yourself inside the shoes of another person and see the world through their eyes And when I started talking a lot about empathy I had parents especially say there's certain things we should be thinking about to help us to be more empathic And so in the many workshops I've given parents and teachers I'm going to just mention a few questions for you know Your listeners to think about I always like to ask parents and the same could be of teachers What words would you hope your children used to describe you and you're always small and say you know Every one of your kids has words to describe you just like you had words to describe your parents So what words do you hope they use and if it's teachers? I will say you know what words do you hope your students use? And then I'll ask the next question And it's same sound simple enough is What do you regularly say and do intentionally say and do on a regular basis so that your kids are likely to use the words you hope they use And then I'll ask and what words do you think they will use now the reason I started to do that is You know giving example I was giving a workshop for teachers and I asked these questions and a number of the teachers said right away We hope how kids see us as caring which is very important you want to feel cared for and then I'll say Okay, what are two or three things you've done in the past two three weeks So they're likely to see you that way And some teachers could tell me right away and some could say I'm not sure You know, that's why in writing books For you know about resilience and how to raise resilient kids You know, you want to give certain things that people can do parents could do and teachers could do To help kids be resilient and the question of what words might they actually use gets people to think about one You know what words I hope they use but what am I doing and saying are they going to actually use these words and I'll give you Another quick example I was giving a workshop. I'm what happened at this workshop. There were about 200 parents there I'm glad does not happen often, but it turned out in some way to be fun I had just finished asking these questions when all of a sudden the woman in the audience basically shout out Oh my I'm up there. I'm thinking there's a medical emergency and I said what is it she says to me Bob those are good questions. I never really thought about them and then she says it's like she's now oblivious that there's like me and her and 199 years she said some she said Can I tell you the first word I hope my kids use to describe me so at this point everyone's in a good mood So I go along and I said what just like this she said I hope the first word they use is calm And I'm thinking oh my god. She does just disrupted And I said to her but there was a positive move there I said to her do you think that's the first word they would use and she just like she said not at all I've been yelling at them for like 10 years. I don't think that's the first word they would use She came up to me afterwards and she said I'm sorry I disrupted the place. I said that's okay people were smiling with you And she said your questions in one sense was so simple, but I never thought about them How would my kids describe me? I mean when I've done marital therapies the same thing how would your husband describe you? You know your wife describe you how would you hope they describe you are always asked for So empathy is very powerful. It's hard to be a charismatic adult If you cannot understand the world through the eyes of the person like your child And it's it's hard to be a charismatic adult It when they feel you don't understand them or you're being hypercritical Or that so that's why empathy plays such a big role in one of my books. I can't remember it's in the book You're alluded to There was someone a well-known a business person who said the most important thing he learned at Harvard Business School And I remember when I was first reading the article. I said what is it was the empathy He said that was one of the most important things because Whatever you world you're in The ability to try to appreciate the world of another person is critical You know an article about that on your website too people can look that up as well. Yes, it's in your book But it's also on your website. I saw that one where I should make you my agent you Did just find a lot of useful information and such a depth of And breadth of topics as well. So a depth there, but also a breadth of so many different the trails that you could go down As you're talking about quitter's day That's you know, so you know heading into this New Year's time where there's New Year's resolutions Like you're talking about everything from quitter's day to the importance of like The small interactions. They're called interactions with weak ties Runner's wave a smile like how a warm greeting you're like it seems like it's unimportant But it's not it's really impactful you talked about Dr. Arthur Brooks in our relation, but I've actually got it I talked to him as well. I really I'm like I love these Dr. Brooks here, but okay, so talking about empathy Let's talk about this so okay something that happens often is that kids and in this book finding the calm child within You're talking about emotional disturbances that are often not equatable with the situation But in general all kids have emotional disturbances and they get upset about different things And you cut their Their sandwich into a square instead of a triangle, you know that that seemed like they're not very important But you use this phrase emotional regulation before consequence-based discipline Mm-hmm, which I think would be helpful for every child you talk about how they can often be too emotionally charged to respond in a way that seems reasonable And shifting the focus from punishment to emotional growth That requires empathy Yes, very much so look when you get you know when your kid is acting up It's very easy after all to get very angry now that particular book focuses on a specific diagnosis But as you say the principles could apply to anyone So where this comes up, you know after I co-authored book raising with civilian children a few years later So many of the questions I got at my talks were disciplined disciplined So I spent the year really I'll say researching and then co-authoring a book on It wasn't called how to you know how to discipline is called very specifically Raising a self-discipline child because my feeling was Discipline Should be used one to make sure there's a safe and secure environment But one of the goals of discipline is to create self-discipline So even if you're not there the child feels comfortable about that So in one of the what one of the things you read Jenny is There are times where especially if a kid is having a meltdown and in that book we're talking about kids who very often for biological reasons mainly have a meltdown Punishing them at those times trying to reason with them at those times. They're not processing anything So there are those instances where you basically almost sometimes if a gion kid have to hold the kid You have you you can't explain things It's afterwards that you can start discussing things you know with the child and For me if a kid is screaming and yelling in your response and Let me tell you as a pair myself. It could get very become very easy to yell back But if you do then you're just reinforcing the acting out behavior And I know this is very difficult So we we have to find ways when our kid is acting out sometimes to give them some space as long as they're not destroying things or hurting themselves Where they can calm down I mean I think sometimes we don't even realize when we're talking to our kids we forget what a meltdown may be They're not hearing anything at all and so The first thing I always feel is like even the title finding the calm child within you've got to calm the child down Well, I hope the child afterwards you could try to discuss it with a child and as in that book We know that some kids even if you discuss it and they'll say okay next time I'll be calmer They still may not be but we slowly can teach them What I call you know coping strategies that will help them to grow and develop that's why raising yourself Discipline child which again implies When you're not there slowly children develop The these inner abilities to really think before they act Yeah Yeah, I mean you talk about the science here that you say They're stuck and you like you said this book is specifically written for children with DMDD Everybody has had a child that's had a meltdown So it works for every paired you say the child isn't a heightened state It may seem like they're overreacting or being defiant But they're stuck they're stuck in emotional high year And you go through like these are the chemicals these are the things that are being released and so I think there has to be a level of empathy there To know that you have to deal with that first Yes, you know, you just said something and I hope I'm not interrupting That is really very important, you know some parents right away want to stop the behavior Which I so totally understand But with empathy what you're really trying to do is one and eventually to use this To you know Are there certain times my child gets more upset than others? Are there things I could do to prevent it in our book raising a self-discipline child I think we have a whole chapter on prevention Because there may be certain things we know what triggers for a child I remember once just to give you a quick example of the four-year-old boy With it what what's called a difficult temperament and Anyway, I saw the parents and the mother said to me, you know I can't even bring him into a grocery store because right away he wants something and if you say no He's screaming and yelling and It was only four so I said to the mother and the both parents with it I said well Why do why do you bring him into the grocery store? She said well kids have to learn I said he may not be capable of learning right now And it was like this huge relief she said first. She said though well other kids four years old can do it I said well you really have to know your kids temperament Yeah She what would happen is even before she went in she would say I got very anxious Which probably the kid felt the same thing? Sorry, you know, so sometimes I don't want to overly simplify it But there may be some things that are triggers that we say okay my can my child handle this How do I prepare my child and some kids as much as you prepare them like with that four-year-old the moment he can't went in there There was just too much stimulation Yeah, and truth be told how unnatural is a grocery store Yeah, four four-year-old in the 1860s weren't going into grocery stores You're right. This is actually a relatively new thing and they do it on purpose don't they? Dr. Brooks like they're putting all the things they have all the toys at the four-year-old level Like they're trying to get your kid to have a meltdown Kim John Payne says they call the parent the um What is the phraseology he uses? Purchasing friction The parent is the purchasing friction and they want the kid to nag and nag and nag and nag so that they make money So I mean I think that's very practical Yeah, what you bring up is See empathy could imply I start with the assumption and I know it may not always be That every child and every parent is doing the best they can under the circumstances And what happens is Sometimes parents mind said is my son could control himself if he wanted to You know if they tried hard, they could do it But once you have that mindset then it's gonna be very critical You know imagine how we would feel I would say this is adults imagine if you were struggling at work And your boss said you know if you tried harder you could do better Would we say thank you and I always say to parents You know Imagine if you came home from work and the first thing you could set to you is did you finish all your work at work today? Because if you didn't there's no television for you tonight And if you studied harder, you know, we could live better or your work harder But that's how kids agree and take that That's a great point who has ever said that to their parent Gosh mom if you just worked harder I could have those nicer shoes that's right Nobody ever but we say it to kids all the time that's right and I say Look I did it with my own son who's very successful today in high school where he thought homework was optional I did not nor did his teachers but When you like when I say it's imagine the first thing you heard when you came home as a parent With something like that But that's what we say and sometimes it's just that of our own anxiety if kids are having struggles or not doing Well in school that's where empathy comes in because I say to parents or if your kid asked you to work harder would would use With they do you think your response would be thank you so much I really appreciate your advice. No, we'd be really angry with our kids And that's why I'm glad you brought up empathy because empathy gets us to think about would we want someone to say to us? Would we just set to our kids and that's why I start with the assumption and I realize it's not always it can be the case But I saw the assumption this parent even if they're spanking too much you know and the Could the couple of punishment even if they're doing this this this It's all they know now. It's the they're doing the best they can The child is doing the best they can see if I start with that assumption which took me a while so Especially because when you read my bio Especially had to learn that when I was principal of the school in the psychiatric hospital It was a locked-door unit these kids would run away if it wasn't locked or and many of them the behaviors which brought them in were really what we co-lacking out behaviors And it was very helpful to me to start saying this you know This kid is doing the best here she can but for whatever reasons You know brain development or whatever reasons that's why in the book about DMDD We talk about that there are other factors which are contributing So it helped me to say this kid is doing the best they can and that's why I started to speak to parents Because a parent saw a kid as lazy or unmotivated they would act one way and I would say to them That's one way of seeing it. I never wanted to put a parent's view down That's one way of seeing it your child's behavior. Can I share with you another way? Because one of the things I learned is if you want a parent to be empathic towards their kid As someone who's seen a lot of parents in counseling or in workshops I have to make sure they experience me as being empathic towards them And that's why I started thinking about the words we use and that's why I started saying one that's one way of viewing your child Can I share another way? Rather than saying you know what you're doing is really wrong because then the parent gets very defensive And that that's why I've also written a lot about the specific words we use and of course the tone of voice we use So people are likely to hear us rather than immediately become defensive and not listen to us Spring has a way of filling up the calendar quickly Field trip sports travel co-op which are all good things But they can make it challenging to keep curriculum learning consistent March is really about maintaining momentum while life gets busy That's why having a flexible organized learning tool can make such a difference in the final stretch of the homeschool year ixl is designed to fit into your routine not complicated ixl is an award-winning online learning platform offering interactive practice in math language arts science and social studies From pre-k through 12th grade at adapts to each child's level keeps it motivated and gives parents clear visibility into progress What I especially appreciate this time of year is how simple and time-saving it is Everything is organized by grade and subjects so you can jump right into Exactly what your child needs whether that's reinforcing a concept before testing or Confidently moving ahead the clear explanations and visible progress markers help kids stay encouraged as they work toward year end of goals Make an impact on your child's learning get ixl now and when thousand hours outside listeners can get an exclusive 20% off ixl membership We may sign up today at ixl.com slash 1000 hours visit ixl.com slash 1000 hours To get the most effective learning program out there at the best place I love all of this all of it. Thank you It's so practical I talked to this man recently his name's dr. Ross green. I know roach. He's a friend of mine. Oh, that's so great I know roach's work very well Yeah, he's got a book coming out called lost. I think it's called lost at school. Yes, uh, he wrote yeah, I wrote that the You wrote that one the new well known he the explosive child is the one he Yeah, I think he go. I think it's on his website The book and they have a quote from the stock the Robert Brooks I think it's on his website about his first book. No, I know I have known Ross for years. Yeah Power philosophies are very similar. Yeah, you know, he folks a lot on the you know the explosive child, but It you know, we both have what are we call a strength base approach really looking at strengths It cuts Ross. It's interesting. You brought him up because he forget his exact statement, but it's something kids would do kids do well if they can yeah kids do that's what you're what you talked about remind him You have the new book that he has coming out is called The kids aren't okay, but he has one already called the explosive child like you talked about and what lost at school Yes, first one. Then he had lost in school Yeah, lost at school or lost in school. Anyway. Oh, yeah, no Ross is Yeah, I have no Ross for probably 35 years now. Oh, pads crossed and Anyway, his work really I would say just resonates with my approach as well. Yeah kids do well if they can yeah So you also talk about in this book and people can find it in all of your work You're talking about with self discipline also learning how to become better problem solvers and decision makers Which is also an important thing in this day and age because a lot of kids are dealing with perfectionism Impulsivity and lack of confidence so people can find information there on your website and also in your books You've got really practical ideas There's like a game called the what if game and the emotion thermometer and the problem solving chart and the decision making jar So practical things because kids are gonna have to make a lot of decisions their jobs are probably not going to be stable And these are things that we need to help them with I love that you had so many stories in your book too Like they're talking about the mom with the four-year-old Going to the grocery store. There was another story where it was the kid was 16 and the you know And the parent is still telling the 16 year old what to expect and they might think oh that kid is too old But to each kid their own. I mean we still tell our kids what to expect We are going as soon as I'm done today. We're going to Washington DC For this event we're like we're leaving at 5 p.m. And you know my kids who are all teenagers mostly Where I like what are we doing when it? Probably has like half a dozen times. I I tell you another quick story. I remember my older son rich He did a semester abroad in London and then he came home You know, I had a great time they have to London. He then traveled by himself by the auto rail around your he comes home and For a few weeks before he's going back to college and so he's going out It's you know these old patterns these they said did you remember to take your wallet and he looks to me It's embarrassed to say to see that Then I traveled all over Europe and I handled it okay, you know, it's like I'm It's that in my books. I talk about you know the negative scripts. You're still saying this And it's not doing any good and so you have to realize at a certain time You know that and it's always can be a balancing act when is when can our kids When do we stop saying did you remember to take you all it? You know and it's kind of sad isn't it because you are losing that role It is a loss for the parent right. It's the loss of caregiver. Yes This is a critical point. I remember one of first workshops. I gave This goes back many years ago Jenny And it was about adolescence and I said you know in for many parents. It's also a period of mourning That's right you that you're giving up the child You know You're having to let go and when you let go, you know, there is this Fert a morning. I said the good news is after the period of mourning There may be a different there will be a different relationship But it's also could be a very wonderful relationship But yeah, I've had parents say to me. I remember a couple I was seeing and they were having trouble with their teenage girl And the father said when the girl was there it was a family therapy. I'm gonna forget this I hadn't thought about this for a while the father said I still I miss when you were four or five and you would sit on my lap and would have been you know with a lot of feeling Yeah, the girl said but then I'm no longer four or five They they you know they were controlling her life too much But it was just in that poignant moment That's why I often talk about these micro moments these brief things that you know Really wake someone up or get them to think of something in a different way And the father you know had to say you're right, but it's It's something I have to deal with Because said especially the father in that case was You know they were just managing or he was managing a life too much and asking too many questions And I was I it was nice that the father could even say I You know when she's four or five she'd sit on my lap and hug me and he had all those memories and that they were not gonna take place anymore And she was able to just say I thought in an empathic way, but I'm not Four or five anymore. Yeah, it's it's in between with that. It is it's a period of morning Different stages, but out of that period of morning could come New identities and new relationships That are still Founded on the work, you know, we've done with kids are younger Yeah, yeah new ways of relating eventually grandkids. Oh, yeah, there's good to come. Yeah Yeah, they delightful having you know For as I mentioned my younger one when I mentioned Dorothy arrow may have been off the uh Just started at the University of Michigan as a freshman and yeah, it's all new relationships uh, yes And and then it's great to see them, but it's it is a somewhat different relationship You know, it's not that like two of the granks of a wild on the road It's not like they used to come over, you know and have sleepovers Then I'm gonna do that anymore, but certainly all of those early experiences leads You know relationships of love and you just have to realize They're adult now Yeah, yeah, they're gonna have class, you know, they may not have time for you Go in your in the area. I remember when all of my grandkids became teenagers You know, oh grandpa bob and you know the hug and then they went out to be with their friends Which is very normal. Yes, yeah, but I even remember that as a as a mother like you know around you know When your kid is kind of clinging to your leg and then yeah, and our kids were kind of clinging So maybe this is older than other kids, but you know eight or nine and they prefer to not cling on your leg And they're gonna go and you're kind of like Mifed or you're kind of like put out you're like wait a minute In it, but it's good because you do you do grow and then you get to have other experiences Through the expansion of themselves like the story you talked about at the beginning about the dad who took the art class Yes, his world did end up expanding Definitely and it expanded he was able to honor his kids island of confidence But most important then I still remember that call when he said how wonderful it felt to see his son smile so much And he was there. I mean that moment You know, yeah, I think what it did also for him is it really offered a sense of hope that he could have a very good relation with his son Even if the son was not interested in sports, which was you know because the father and Father's father that's how they but I hate to you. It's over you sometimes the word bonded But they bonded over sports. So he was bonding over If we want to use that word over art Yeah, or the other kid it was gardening otherwise your world is narrow If your father was into sports and you're into sports and then your kids in a sport then you just have this narrow thing Otherwise, it's really expanded. So it's a beautiful way to look at it I would love if you talked a little bit about technology because you wrote in this book about screen sizes And you have this statement the small devices may stimulate the brain activity differently resulting in dysregulation I thought that was a really interesting point because you brought up at the very beginning screen time You said in the 80s people were still concerned about screen time But it was a different size Right And it was very heavy and you couldn't carry it in your pocket and there was only programming at certain times of the day for kids And so talking about emotional Disregulation. This is a piece of it. It's also stealing I think from the islands of competence What advice are you giving to parents these days about that? Yeah You know, I don't want to sound overly old-fashioned. So I'll mention a few things. I am very pleased That many schools now The kid has to put away not only put away. They have to hand it to the teacher The phones and I am in the board of a school Here in the Boston area with kids who've had emotional learning problems And it was interesting. It's just one example The school last year said that kids would come to school and they would hand in their phones And what you put in the you know, I don't know locked up or whatever it was And so I asked the head of the school this wonderful woman I said how was it she said the first day or two the kids really were upset But by the third or fourth day They were more relaxed and relating with each other So one thing is in schools. I think it's very important You know in terms of limiting these distractions And I think at home I say to parents you know, I know it's difficult Especially with cell phones and everything but I think there has to be a limit You know, we have to get out more or also even in colder weather You know, I live in the Boston area. You're in Michigan. We just have to get out more I take a walk do certain things You know, I grew up in Brooklyn, New York and well before screen time And We would be out playing all the time. Yeah, I mean The schools weren't even open like on a weekend. We'd be playing basketball if it was 15 degrees out But it was just nice to be out there now. I know those days are not gonna happen again But I think parents a couple things they have to clearly you know, they have to be set some guidelines as kids get older Certainly one has to turn more over to the kid the other one of the other issues is Which I've heard from a lot of kids and I've seen is Many parents are really absorbed by their phones I remember when my grandson Teddy was playing in a soccer you know, they were I think seven years old the kids And I always love soccer because he meant if a kid was disorganized it always looked like 20 kids The ball was like a morph you know more following a light basically And a kid scored a goal a Jenny and he was so happy And this was a kid who was not well coordinated and he immediately looked at his father And his father was Was father was looking something screen father totally missed everything And the look of disappointment. So I also say to parents you've got to regulate your Also, you're usable now the other thing is there been some interesting articles coming out and I know it goes beyond screen time about AI I will tell you I have found you know like chat GPT To be very good in terms of doing research. They come up with articles But you then have to still they'll write the article for you But you really have to write it if you feed yourself and it been several articles by well known say cognitive psychologist Who say if AI if the kid is using AI to actually solve a problem and write the article It's robbing them of their experiences of problem solving and you mentioned problem solving before So it's one thing to do some research and get articles like I've done But then the actual writing and putting together solutions If we just depend on AI especially now we're talking about kids young adolescents We're we're robbing them one of the most important things to be able to be critical thinkers And that's one of my concerns and especially reading some of the articles I've been collecting is You know, what is the cost When everything is being done for you including writing the article but synthesizing things So again, I know how I use it it pulls up articles I didn't even know about But I still want to be able to then synthesize these articles And it really be a good problem solver and I say to parents you know Guidelines could be set but they have to be set for you About how much screen time the difficult thing is of course Some kids will say well, I'm doing my homework here and that's always difficult You know the parents can't always micromanage But there should be times where there is no screen time You know and uh and but that means for us as well You can't ask your kids to put them their phones if we're Using phones all the time and when parents tell me yeah, but we're adults. I say yes But if the child sees you Not respecting you know times to put down your phone We model things for our kids. So we have to be very you know, we have to be very conscientious About our own screen time Yeah, like when they say about weird adults then it's like exactly Exactly and all the more reason it goes back to the empathy piece exactly like empathy has to start with the adults first If we wanted to trickle down. Definitely All right, let's just wrap it up here. Okay. What makes us human? What makes us human? So not only are there these 23 books people can check out and I'll make sure I'll put a link in the show notes to a lot of the ones that would be really Of interest to this audience. So tenacity and children nurturing the seven instincts for lifetime success chasing Chasing positivity the charismatic advisor in conversation play therapy play therapy Of course, that's going to be interesting interesting to this audience inventions Interventions to enhance relationship to enhance this messing up everything enhance resilience And we talked about the self-discipline child. There's a handbook of resilience seven steps to help your child to worry less Angry children worried parents seven steps to help families manage anger seven steps to improve your child social skills Understanding and managing children's classroom behavior. I mean these are all applicable So lots of options there and then on your website you have a new article that comes out every month The one that came out today is about mattering. Yes So can you give us a little brief about that and then yeah Well, and then people could go to the website because we're gonna be out of time But you have an article called what makes us human? Yeah, I'll quickly mention mattering because yeah, you know to be resilient you have to feel That has to be what we call unconditional love, you know, you're loved unconditionally so love from you know the significant people in your life That's what makes one a charismatic adult if you will they gather strength from us And this was interesting the other because the other thing in many my books and articles is one of the things that helps us to feel valued Is if we are engaged in helping other people it is amazing Three years old or 93 years old we now know that when you help others it actually lessened stress as long as you're not volunteering 100 hours a week Yeah, and what what I really loved about this article was published I the Center for the developing child at Harvard is I'd heard the word mattering but not quite like this and what they say in that article starting from birth The way we hold kids and sued them Helps you to start feeling love and they said they're two main components one is when one is to feel valued And the other is to add value to other people which I call You know in my books and work engage in what I call contributory of charitable activities Yeah, well, you know that even when we're talking about kids with the MDD I found when you us these kids to help out in some way It really reinforces a sense of dignity in them. They feel at least there's something I could do well So this report came out I just read it for the first time last week I said oh that's what I'm gonna do my next article about because it just off-tailed with other things that you know We start helping kids feel a matter But just even as infants how we hold them and sue them and then as they get older That we have to help them provide opportunities where they feel That they are adding value to others. That's why when I go up to schools about a kid who's having problems Or when I talk to parents, but let's say someone go into school One of the first things I ask is what is one thing this child does at school that helps him or her feel they are making a positive difference You know there regard and I learned that Certainly many years ago when I was principal that school in the psychiatric hospital I found even some of these kids with major issues in their lives When you ask them could they help you? It was it was just amazing how they were more focused We all want to feel we make a difference And now we know it said any age in the article that came out today I talked about research with people between the ages of 34 I think and 93 And what help people to evenly longer lives is when they were involved in helping others And that's one of the strategies I use all the time Yeah, no matter and matter of fact with young kids I used to have a little to plomar to get assistant psychologist I said you're really helping me here I couldn't do it without a lessons because they weren't a part of the fee but anyway And that but these were the little things that you know help people feel these kids feel valued Oh, Bob is with such a treat. Thank you for saying yes I am such a fan of your work And it's you know, it's one of the things that In just an hour conversation people will be able to take away so many ideas You know of all these questions that we can ask ourselves and questions that we can ask others in ways that we can approach Our relationships and our children truly such an honor. We always end our show with the same question With the favorite memory from your childhood that was outside One of them there are several but one I will never forget and it has to do with how my father was my charismatic My my father owned a little like candy store in Brooklyn And one day I think I was about four years old one day I went with him Uh to pick up I don't know what we were picking up candy or whatever at some supplier and There was a platform and I was on the platform and I remember the soul vividly and My father was down. It's see my 20 feet. I'm sure it was like two feet And he held up his arms and I was a little hesitant and someone you know if we work there said he'll catch you And I remember them jumping off and he caught me and I from me I've often used that memory. There are many others also with my with my mother But that particular memory I said the reason so important to me is he was gonna catch me Yeah, I could take a risk and he was gonna catch me and that was the kind of man he was So that was one of the most in you know important uh Memories and again, I could spend an hour telling you different memories But I always remember that he was there He was gonna catch me. I could jump off which seemed like probably Mount Everest at the time But it was probably a totally terrible Now regard Okay, what a dream to have a dad that owns a candy store You have to be careful Yeah, it's super unique and cool. Oh Dr. Bob Brooks. I so appreciate your time these work the work that you've done is so influential for parents and And even more so as you're entering into this age of AI already actually in it that these things of empathy and resilient and Preserveer and sintonacity are so important. Thank you for your time Well, you're at the light your enthusiasm as I said is just great and thank you for inviting me. It's been a pleasure Get outside open your eyes feel that sunshine kissing your skin. Throw your worries out to the wind Climbs some trees skin your knees feel that grass on your feet again Get out there and take you to Oh It's a beautiful Ain't nothing on screen. It's ever gonna be this view Oh It's a beautiful And I just want to share with I just want to share with you It's beautiful Such a beautiful world