A Financial Plan Only Works If It Matches Your Reality

Hey, before we get rolling, listen up, if you want to win with money in 2026, you can't keep living normal, normal's broke. You need a plan, get a personalized plan and start living like no one else by downloading our every dollar app today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. We're here to help you transform your life from the Ramsey network in the Farawind's Credit Union studio. This is the Ramsey show alongside the fabulous Jade Worshaw. I'm Ken Coleman. The phone number is triple eight eight to five five to two five triple eight eight to five five to two five. All right, we're going to get your calls coming up very soon. Really fun story for my colleague here. You may know her journey. She and Sam are hubs paid off half a million dollars in debt. She gets you folks. You're in debt. She gets you. She really does. Fun story I asked her to share. I've gotten to know her and Sam very well. And so that's coming up. You don't want to miss that. Those of you who are kind of on that edge today, you're going, can I do this? Can I make it? You can make it. She's going to tell you how it's going to be fun. But first, Jack is up in Indianapolis, Indiana, Jack. How can we help today? Hey, guys. Thank you so much for taking my call. I bought a RV for 60,000 on a 15 year loan at 18% interest. Wow. Why'd you do that? I'm realizing how bad of a decision it was. It was to live in to save up eventually for our house. And I'm realizing like the interest is 800 a month. I'm just interest. My goodness. Only 50 bucks goes to the principal and I'm realizing it'll be like 16 months before I even scratch the surface under what I borrowed. So I was wondering because obviously I want to get out of the now. I started the baby steps. All I had was like a thousand personal loan, 2000 personal loan. I had some suit loans. I had some credit cards, but I only made 2000 a month when I bought it. So I don't even know how I got it through for it. Right. But I went one by one. And I got rid of everything except for the camper. My income is about 4,000 a month now. OK. So where are you living? I got a job as a truck driver. So in the truck. OK. OK. Are you OK? You don't sound very OK to me. And maybe it's just your voice, but I'm just. Since I'm really nervous. I'm really nervous. I just. OK. Yeah. OK. OK. So you've got. Did I understand correctly when you said you got rid of all the other debt except this RV? Yeah. Everything. OK. Good. I did make a little mistake. I know you're supposed to save a thousand first with the first thousand. But it towards the debt. OK. But yes, I have my $1,000. Everything else is gone. Good. Thanks for this camper. And you still owe 60. What's it worth if you were to sell it? The dealership offered 31. Oh, Lordy. But what if you were to sell it private sale? Have you looked into that? I haven't listed for 38. And I've been trying to call the show for a couple of months now. So I owe 48 on it now. You owe 48 on it now and you could sell it for 31. 38. I've got a list of that. I have a list of 13. So you're a 10,000, it's a $10,000 deficit there. What keeps you from going down to a credit union or going down to a bank or getting any kind of loan to clear this out? Why don't we do that? I cancel my credit cards when I remove them and it brought my credit score down pretty low. Uh-huh. What about a credit union? Have you gone into a bank to see? Because at this point, here's here's my thinking on this. My rationale is there's not a worse loan than the one you have. And this is going, you're going down, you're going from $48,000 of debt to $10,000 of debt. I'm going to take that deal every time, even if even if the terms aren't great. Well, yeah, because you're going to knock it out. You make $4,000 a month. You knocked out the other debt. Why can't you knock out this $10,000 debt very quickly? That's true. Um, I was, uh, because I was trying to rent it as well to see if I could try to get money out of it. Um, but every moment you wait, it's dropping in value because because you're in such a bad loan, right? The interest alone is $800 a month. So you got time is not on your side, my friend. Listen, we're coming to you from the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I'd call our friends at Fairwinds and say, have just on the show, which, Jay, there you go. And here's my situation. And, uh, I've made progress. Well, you guys help me out and, and, and, and they can help you out. They will. And into your, into Jay's point, then if we can sell this thing and then they take over the loan for the, the minimal amount you're going to have left, you can knock that out. So you want to get rid of this because this is a depreciating asset. That's why she's telling you that you got to get rid of it. I would only, and for anybody listening who's like, oh, Jay told him to get a loan. She told him to take it out on credit cards. She told him to take a bad loan. We're going down people. We're going from 48 down to 10. We're not going up. He's not taking a loan to go into debt. He's taking a lesser loan to get out of debt. So that's the difference there for anybody who's trying to clock something that's not there. Yeah. And now what is this, is this truck job? What's your opportunity to make more money than the 4,000 a month? Well, in the beginning, um, it was just like, that's what I was getting because I was in training. I also do all the services on his trucks because he owns, um, he owns a truck company. So I do all the mechanic work on them for side money on cash when I am, uh, at Indianapolis, um, because it is long haul. So as we look forward, how much more additional money can you make than the 4,000? 4 to 6,000 a month, I'd say take home. All right. And long term is, is this a great opportunity for you to get to the 6 figure range? Uh, it seems like it, yeah. Okay. All right. Well, what's the lesson here, uh, what that you've learned, you know, because lots of times we'll teach out of this. I want people here from you today because you're, you're sitting in this calling us with a pit and you're stomach. So what's the lesson for everybody else? Don't get the dealership, uh, Mark, don't get the warranty stuff. Um, don't buy new. Like ask someone older than you. Yeah. I, you know, I have it. Yeah. Uh, it's, uh, I'm definitely not doing that anymore. Yeah. How old are you, Jack? I just turned 20, 20 years of it. You learned a great lesson at a young age, my friend. That's awesome. I wish you did it cost 60,000. Yeah. That's all right. But it's a good lesson to learn. Hey, no one, no one gets that, if, let me say, not no one, few people get out unscathed. When you, when you walk into the real world, right, you get out of college, you start your life as an adult, few, Jack, uh, get out of this without making major mistakes. That's how we learn. And for you, I want you to look at this. Don't look at it as, oh my gosh, my mistake. I ruined my life. Just look at it as some research you did. You did a little bit of research and you found out that buying an RV to live in or buying anything that goes down in value is not a good idea. Now you can stick that in your pocket and keep it as a knowledge base for later. Yeah, I love it. Makes me think of the old song. What? My Ray Charles. Hit the road, Jack. And don't you come back no more, no more, no more. Hit the road, Jack. That's what he's saying to debt. That's good. Yeah, come on. You know, sometimes I think of these old school things. Now if Ray told her next to me, she had no idea what I'm talking about. I thought you were going to say something totally different. No, hit the road, Jack. Oh, okay. He got on the road and in the 18 wheeler, he's getting after it. He's 20 years of age. You learn his lesson. I love his lessons. He did a great job, America. You heard, Jack. And he's going to be okay. He's going to do great. He's only 20 years of age. He's learned a big lesson. Now he's on the road to being debt free. Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance. Or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're going to die or something? Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids and I immediately went and got term life insurance. That's a gut punch. And you're telling me for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse. They've lost somebody important to them. Me too. They don't know what to do next. Me too. I mean, you're going to have a crisis here. And you know, you got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow. She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not miss this up. Or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow. That's exactly the two options. And turn your dad gum family. Turn life insurance can replace income, have debts, cover funeral expenses. So your family can actually have the opportunity to just be sad. Yeah. To just miss you. That's exactly what it's supposed to be. It's saying I love you to your family. Turn life insurance, Jeff Zander and the team of the Zander insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years of the only people I trust go to Zander dot com or call 800 356 42 82. Welcome back to the R&D show America. So glad you're with us. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshall is alongside. Triple eight 825 5225 is the phone number. Triple 8 825 5225. We go next to San Jose, California. Jeff is there. Jeff. How could we help? Hi. Yeah. Me and my fiance were about a million dollars in debt right now. And we kind of most of it student loan debt, but we still have a million dollars. We just don't know how to really tackle my goodness. Is this what type of degrees did you guys have? Yeah. We're both Dennis. So I guess that's a good thing. Kind of. Yeah. Yeah, I can tell you're fired up by that. Bless your heart. Yes. Are you making money? Like what are you guys making every year? So what we're told when we go into this is we'll be able to pay it off. Don't worry. That's right. We make about probably average 170 a year. That's what you guys are actually paying yourself. Yes. In our before taxes before taxes. Oh my gosh. 170 gross. And are you separate practices? Uh, we are currently, but we're probably going to group in together and just try to grow, I guess. Did you say 170 each or combined? Okay. Okay. 170 gross each was it. That's not bad. Yeah. And you're living in. Okay. Well, San Jose is expensive. That's a expensive part of the country. What is your debt? Break it down for Jay. Let's go you first. You're the one on the phone and you're not married yet. So what's your debt? Uh, about. Let's see. 450,000 right now. And all student loan. Okay. And no other debt. Luckily, we're both pretty good on that side. Okay. Pretty good or good? Good. How long have you been practicing? Um, about a year now, we just kind of, we just came out of school. It's just kind of a nervous thing to be a million dollars in debt. Just. And how? No, no, listen, brother. This is real. And I, I, I, oh, this makes me so mad on your behalf. Not mad at you, but, but people are just selling this and now you're facing it. You're just like staring down the barrel of a gun right now. I can feel it all over you. And, and well, here's the thing I'm asking about. You're only a year into this. Based on, I don't know if they teach you any business skills, probably not. But, unfortunately, they don't, they don't. Any sense of, of, of, of how big your practice is, uh, in, in, in its first year, are you small for first year? Are you medium size? Do you have any sense of that? That's, I would say we're probably small, getting to medium, hopefully by the end of this, by the end of this bill. So do you know any dentist at all that are very successful? Huh? Yes, I do. Are you in contact with them on a regular basis to go, how did you grow your business? No, you need to be. I'm not. You need to be. I'm not kidding you. Jay's going to give you some financial advice, but I was leading you this because let me tell you something. They don't teach you how to run a business. They teach you how to take care of teeth. But taking care of teeth is not enough to be a successful dentist. You have got to know how to get people in the chair. Yeah, that's right. And I want you on the phone. I'm going to give you as a gift of mine, Christian. At the end of this call, I want to give him the proximity principle. Uh, it's worth a quick read. You get the audio book. If you want that, we'll give you whatever version you want. But I want you to be in touch with successful dentist and I mean successful. And I want you telling them, I need your best advice. What would you say to me where I'm at right now about growing my business and try to replicate this with two or three other successful dentists, get all that feedback in one bucket and start doing it. Because the quicker you grow this business, the more you can pay yourself in the morning, pay yourself. The easier it is to do what Jay is going to tell you, I just wanted to give you that. You've got to be like a, and she's got to be the same way. If you guys combine practices, this can't be like, we were married and we have to know you both are like, you're the most, I don't want to say desperate dentist we've ever seen, but it's like, you got to get creative in the community and be competitive so that everybody's coming to you to get the teeth cleaned. Okay. Can I ask a question? And this is both to Ken and you Jeff. So you come at a dental school, you've got all the goods to be able to practice. Are you working for someone else or you started your own thing? I'm working for someone else, but we're working on a contract to hopefully partner. And is that going to cause you to have to go into more debt? Cause that's what I'm trying to get a sense of what your next plan is, because I don't want you to go into more debt. And that's why we're trying to hold off. No, bro. Okay. I'm more debt. No, no, no. You got to do your own practice, man. I thought that's what we were talking about. You can't go into debt. It's not worth it. No, like you got you got to you got to work for someone else until you can afford to do whatever the next step is. Is your income fixed though, after all that big speech I gave is your income fixed? Are you able to go recruit new patients and get some of that? No, not fixed. So you can. So you can benefit from hustling like I told you to do. Yes. Okay. Okay. That's goodness. That's all I was trying to get at. And I don't want you to go into any more debt until this is cleaned up because again, you're what you're realizing now is true. Yes, you have agency over this, but there's no guarantees and there's no guarantees at how quickly this will go. And so going into further debt, I would not advise that. Looking at the numbers, the hard part for me is you are in an expensive area. What are you paying? Like what's the, what's the housing situation? Are you renting? Do you own a place? What is it? We're going to, we're going to be owners because it doesn't, it almost doesn't make sense to rent because then we're just throwing that. That's not true. From the map. What are you doing right now? What's the situation now? About 4500 a month for your place. Or are you guys together already together? You're already. It'll be 4500 yet. Okay. To rent, but to buy it the same. Yes, but you're going into debt to get it. You're adding more debt to your name. We will do. Yes. And you're tied to that. Like you, you got to pay it. And now you're adding expenses to your life as well. You can't afford to do that. You need to be living as cheaply as possible. And if it's the same price per month, it's not really the same price because your complex or whatever is paying for yard and garbage and all those things. So I don't want to add weight to you of having to replace an AC or having to replace a roof or having to use it. I'm saying. Yeah. So that's it. Or adding insurance. You know, all that stuff is really expensive. And so I would continue to rent. You're not throwing money down the drain. You are buying yourself time until you can truly afford to buy. So please promise me your homework coming off. This call is to promise me that you won't go into debt into this practice right now. And that you will not buy a home right now because that would add insult to injury. And I'm going to throw in here. I'm going to challenge you to get a much, much better rent situation. Just try find a place over an old lady's garage. I say that all the time, but I'm telling you, I don't think you should guys should be paying anywhere near 4,500 a month. Not now. You guys are so broke. Yeah. You need to be. You almost need to be staying in a place where they're paying you. Jeff, you, you, you're going to have to fight, Jeff, you're going to have to fight hard because the true things you guys have got these shiny degrees. You're in a great profession where there's the potential to make a lot of money. And the people around you, probably the people that you're working with, they're coming in with their tall hose and their catalax and their Teslas and they get expensive salads and juices for lunch. You don't do that. You eat lean cuisine and you drive a Ford Taurus. And I would prescribe a lot of fasting for this call. It's the new, it's the new craze. It's a biblical principle. And I think it's got some financial advantages here. You all need to try fasting three days at a time. You're going to look great, but you can't even afford to buy cold cuts. Yeah. Carl butting. Do you remember? I don't know. Listen, Jeff, I don't know if you remember when I was coming up, the cheapest cold cuts you could buy or were older than these youngster. Okay. But in all seriousness, Jeff, listen, um, you have got to reduce your living expenses right now. That's one of the biggest raises that you could give yourself. So I'd be as soon as this rental term is up or whatever's going on, I would be looking to slash those costs. I mean, big time. Uh, okay. Even if I got to drive a ways at this point, I'd rather pay gas, you know, y'all ride together. Uh, it's called public transportation. Everything's on the table now, right? Everything you get you a bus pass. It's on and pop in. It's the truth. It is. Like, and by the way, you're brown bagging it and you're recycling the bag. Oh, yeah. Do you know what I mean? That's going to be all pretty good. When you rinse out the zip lock bag and you got to dry it out and use it again. Yeah. Like, y'all put the whoa broke. I mean, yikes. This is the rave show. The last thing you need this holiday season is more stuff collecting dust or tech that keeps you glued to screens and up too late. You need better sleep. And that's what you'll get with Casper. Their mattresses are made for deep uninterrupted rest that keep you cool and comfortable. So you wake up feeling ready, not wrecked because rest is not a luxury. It's an investment. And the ROI is your well being. So go to Casper.com slash Ramsey and use promo code Ramsey for 25% off mattresses and 10% off everything else yet free shipping to that's Casper.com slash Ramsey promo code Ramsey. Exclusion supply. Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside the incomparable fabulous Jade Warsaw. I'm Ken Coleman. The phone number is triple eight eight to five five two two five. If you want to jump in triple eight eight to five five two two five. Sam is up in Birmingham, Alabama. Sam, how can we help today? Hey guys, so I want to know if you would honestly recommend that I start with a $1,000 a month emergency fund. And and why after kind of reading you off some stats here. So I be 30 I be 30% interest rate on a $33,000 car loan. I have nine K and back taxes owed five key and credit card debt nothing. My ex girlfriend has 50 K and credit card debt that I kind of want to help her out with your ex girlfriend. And on top. Unfortunately, yeah, and you want to help her with the debt. Yeah, wow. Sorry, I just that guy. Really nice guy. I'd like to know more. Yeah. Why are we doing this? Well, you know, she was a six year relationship. I lost her last Q four. I was pushing myself too hard, finally burnt out after after about 10 years of extremely hard work. And I just feel responsible for a lot that I'm sure some of that's mine. I'm sure a good bit of it might be mine. You used her card. You used her card sometimes. Well, we were together, you know, like it was a like she would help out with. Like I don't know. I think someone I think my car insurance, for example, is on the credit card. Okay. I think so you don't even know. Listen, how does that change your opinion? No, does it change your opinion? I'm going to say something really controversial right now. I'm very excited. She probably wrote in your car lots of times. Does she need to help you pay off your car? You know what I'm saying? I'm not letting her do that. You probably see she makes a good point. You know, your credit card, you may have paid for some things for her. I think what it sounded like, I don't know, but it sounded like she got away. It sounds like you're still recovering from this. He's dealing with guilt. You still care for her. You might feel some guilt. Obviously, you still care for her, but I would not feel any obligation to pay 50k to an ex. Is she asking for money? Not really now. Do you want to know what I think? Do you want to know what I might think as your older sister who cares for you? Okay. This is like when you go on a date with somebody, I think this was from Seinfeld, and he would leave something in her apartment on purpose so he would have a reason to come back and knock on the door. Brilliant move. Yeah. I remember that. I feel like this is a reason for you to come back and knock on the door. Yeah. Well, I love her. I mean, and you're not. You're not ready to let go. If you could dedicate a song to her right now, what would you dedicate? Oh, great question. I'm saying this seriously. What is it? I think this also listen. There's too many to count. I'm writing, I'm writing letters about every day. I'm sorry to her. To her. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Oh my goodness, what's the snowball? Where are we at on the snowball? Did we get there? No, because your initial question, I'm sorry, I got hung up on your love situation. The initial question was, do I really want him to go down to a thousand dollars of an emergency fund? Yeah, if that were my starter, where do I start here, guys? Yeah, that is where it starts. So let me just go through the baby steps with you right quick, Sam. Just so you see how this all fits and how long have you been listening to the show? Are you a new listener? I'm a new listener, yeah. You guys are on my YouTube shorts. Okay, so you only get bits and pieces on that. Thanks for watching, but you only get bits and pieces. So the first step, this is seven baby steps for you to achieve financial pieces, what we're talking about. So you do them, all of that I'm saying you do them consecutively in order. That's the first thing. You gotta do them in order. If you jump around, it won't work, and you'll be wasting your time. The first step is you get a thousand dollars saved. So if you don't have any money saved, you gotta go out, work, sell stuff, and get it done. If you do have money saved, you drop it down to thousand dollars. And then the next whatever money you had leftover is gonna go to baby step two, which is you paying off all of your debt, except your mortgage. This is all the consumer debt. Okay, and you do this using the debt snowball method. Debt snowball is we list all the debts smallest to largest. You pay minimum payments on everything, and then any extra money goes to the smallest debt. Does that make sense? Yep. Okay, after that, now we stack up that emergency fund. Three to six months of expenses is what we're looking for. You get to decide it is a three, four, five, or six. After that. So number three is three or four thousand dollars a month in expenses. Three to six months of basic living expenses. So just for round numbers, let's say you had five thousand dollars, fourth of expenses every month. What we're saying is that three months is 15,000, six months is 30,000. You tracking? Yep. All right, so that's what we mean by an emergency fund. We give you the kind of, we say three months is a minimum. So that'd be 15,000 on this example. That's what she's talking about. That's right. For baby step three, it's really about your basic budget. It's not three to six months of paychecks necessarily. It's what it takes to make your house go on a basic level. Okay. Baby step three, B, it's B because it's not the case for everybody, is if you're looking to buy a house, now's when we start saving up a down payment for the house. Okay. After that, you go to baby step four. You could do three, B, and four at the same time if you want to. You're putting 15% of your gross income into retirement funds. So that's your 401k, Roth IRA, that sort of thing. Then after that, if you have kids, your plan for kids, you can put an amount of your discretion towards kids college. We say 529 or an ESA is where you would do that. Then finally, baby step six, if you have extra money in your budget, again, at your discretion, you're throwing extra money towards paying off your house early. Most people who do that pay off their house in like 10, 12 years. That's... Then finally, baby step seven, you just live like no one else, you give, you're a happy person, and you got no cares. That's the big, arching picture. You buy a tie in cars with cash. Hey, okay. Can we talk about, I'm dying right now. You did such a good job. Can we talk about this man's car? Yeah, tell us about it. What's the car we're seeing? Pain is a picture. Man, the car is like 21k. I bought it for a very, I think Dave will appreciate this. So like I'm 29, I have an online business, and I bought an Alfa Romeo because it was the coolest car you could get under the car. Love it. Love it. How much did you pay for it? I'm asking. Yeah. So all in taxes, I had no down paying those about 33,000. Just a loan on paying off. Okay. So like yeah, extra. So it's worth 21k. Okay. Yeah. I think I can get a little more for it. I think I might be able to get like 24, 26, if I want to. Okay, good. I mean, you got, I think you got to sell this car right now. At 30% interest rate, Jade, I know that's extreme, but I. He said it's 3%, 3%. I thought he said 30. Is it 30? That was 30. Yeah, 30. You asked that twice and he said 30. Oh, I. T.H. I.R.T. And I just turned 41 in my old age. I can't hear you. He's paying 30% on this car. That's painful. Yeah, you got to get out today. Like you got to sell it. Do you have any money saved? No, I can get some money this month. I mean, the income is good. Yeah, you got to find, you got to find at least $10,000. So you can get out of this and get yourself a little bitter car to drive around until you can save up for a better one. So yeah, but is that, you know, here's the reason I bought this car. It was the coolest car under 30k. And what do you make? No, it doesn't matter how cool it is. What do you make? Well, I'm $99, $200 a month consistently for two years. But last Q4, I was paying myself about 14k a month. Really going overboard with the whiskey and the oysters. Here's what I want you to do. Listen, what a life. Here's what I want you to do. I want you to apply that 9200 to get out of debt. I want you to quickly save up what you can to get out of this car by something cheap and cash. It's only temporary. You're going to be out of debt in a year. And then you're going to save up and you're going to buy the same car and cash. All right, Jay and I are going to look into some whiskey and oysters ourselves. I know that's right. For after the show, we'll see what the order looks like. But we'll be right back. This is the Ramsey show. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. The holidays are full of traditions. Some of these traditions we love, some we just survive. And in addition to the traditions, let's be honest. This time of year can also be a time of noise and pressure and loneliness. Here's what I want you to do. I want you to ask yourself what really matters to you this year. In therapy, can give you a space to do just that, to think, to breathe, to ask yourself what do you want this year and to make room for peace. That's why I recommend BetterHelp. BetterHelp has over 30,000 licensed therapists that have helped over 5 million people worldwide with an average rating of 4.9 out of 5 stars. BetterHelp is online so it fits around your schedule, even during the chaotic holiday times. You get online and just answer a few questions and they'll match you with someone who fits your needs. And if your therapist is not the right fit, you can switch anytime for no extra cost. This month, start a new tradition by taking care of you. Visit BetterHelp.com slash Ramsey to get 10% off your first month. It's BetterHelpHELP.com slash Ramsey. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show alongside Jade Worshaw. I'm Ken Coleman. So glad you're with us today as we help you win with your money. And in your profession and win with your relationships, AAA 825225. Jade, I'm a little excited about it and I don't naturally celebrate these things like I should. Super excited. Been dreaming about a show concept for a long time and we've been working on it as a team. The team's done a great job. It's called Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman and it has people ask it. Has it replaced the Ken Coleman show? Yes. Because it is a very different format. Imagine you're sitting in on a deep dive conversation with somebody who's a thought leader, someone who has done something extraordinary in their lives. They are a man or a woman of success and you get to be a part of the audience and you're sitting around with us asking a question. Well, that is the format. Live format. We record it and then also we have a virtual format where people can zoom in if you will. So we're bringing the audience to the Front Row Seat. That's the concept. It's on YouTube now or wherever you get your podcast. New episode comes out every Tuesday morning. If you want to get better personally, move up professionally and lead effectively, those are the conversations. Wow. How do you source your, like, guess, how do you pick, how do you select your guests? Because you've got had some wonderful guests. Yeah, we have some really fun guests and the way it goes down is, you know, we're selecting people within those categories. For instance, people that can help experts can help out in the area of personal growth. So that would be an expert maybe on sleep or nutrition or exercise. Oh, okay. Right. Holistic. We're mixing it up, right? And then, of course, we have people that are professional gurus. It can help you on certain soft skills. Like we just had Charles Doohig. We just recorded that or come out soon. Pule It's a prize winning author of the book, Super Communicators. Wow. So we're talking about the three types of conversation. So how do we use those types of conversation to win in our profession, but also win at home? That's so helpful. And then, of course, leadership experts. So it's very intentional between those three buckets of content that makes sense. Well done, Ken. Thank you. I'm really excited about it. It's beautiful, by the way, if you want to check it out on YouTube, the team did a great job with the set. Looks really, really fun. So the front row seat is the name of the show, Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman. You can get it on YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. Let's go to Brianna who's joining us in Dallas, Texas. Brianna, how can we help today? Hi, yes, I have a question. Well, I'm so my advise. Me and my husband are thinking about selling our home because we're just drowning in debt and we just don't have any other option to try to get out of it, but to sell our home. So yes, that's what is what is what is created that scenario where you don't believe you have any other options? Give us some details. Well, we are just drowning in debt and I know y'all we failed to pay the cars and we looked into it. We owe, and one of our cars we owe like 9,000. Okay. And we try to see if we can sell it, but we will be under. It's really not worth selling. It's just, I guess, right now we just better off paying it off. The other one is 12,000 and that one as well as negative. So I remember like, okay, we might as well just try to hang on to those and try to pay those off and everything else is loans and credit cards through the loans. Go through the other ones. Go through the other amounts for us so we can get a picture of this. So the 9,000 dollar car, the 12,000 dollar car, what else? And then loans, like personal loans, like 20,000 credit cards is around like 35 to like 40,000. Okay. Loading loans is my husband is like 73,000. Okay. How much are yours? I don't have any good. And my real, the IRS is like 95, 100. Okay. And then I have medical bills that's like 3,000. Okay. Okay. What's your combined income? Combined income is like 10,500 to like 11,000 per month. Yes. Okay. And have you added up, if you don't know, it's okay. But if I were to ask you on the spot, like how much does this cost you in payments every month? Do you know the number to that? Like to get a loan and like 4,000, probably a little bit more. Okay. So you're paying 4,000 in payments. And then tell me, what's your mortgage? Tell me about the mortgage. Tell me what you owe. The mortgage is like 31, 3,100. Okay. And that's what you're paying per month. But tell me how much you bought the house for. The house we bought it for 386. What's it worth? What's it worth? Right now is worth like 385, 387. Oh, sweetheart, if you sell the house, that's not going to give you guys any much money at all. I know we owe 3,40 on it right now. Right. So if you're paying your realtor, there's very little of this that is going to actually solve this problem. Right. That's what we were like, okay, so we just try to buy for it or should we try to sell it and try to at least get out of it? Jade's got something to tell you. I mean, I was really thinking this because my husband drives like an hour and a half commute to his job. Okay. Interesting. He wanted to move closer to his job because it's a long drive. Is that it? Is it? Is it for less money in that location? Sorry, Jay. That's okay. The rent is probably going to be like 2000. Yeah, not much different. Not much difference. Well, no, you're saying you're paying 3,100 per month. Oh, yeah, that is that is actually huge difference. Right. 3,100 plus the HOA. Oh, that's not including HOA. What's your HOA? 250 every quarter. Okay, every quarter. Okay. I would consider moving, Jade, in this situation because that's a long way to commute number one. Well, there's a couple of things you got that big commute. I was going to ask you is it an hour and a half each way or is that combined? Because if it's 40 minutes, that's not as big of a deal. But No, it's each way. Oh, yeah, I've definitely moved into the office. Three days out of the week. So two days he'll work from home. But three days out of the week, he has to drive to the office. It's still a lot. Three hours driving in a day is a lot to get to work. So that's one that's one green light. It's not the biggest reason because like you said, it's not like he's going in every day, but it is a reason. The biggest reason for me to consider getting out of this house is because it's more than 25% of your take home pay. And at this point, you need every dollar that you can get your hands on. Now, there is a thought here. And you guys need to sit and talk about this because there's a thought where I go, OK, if you guys really start side hustling, if you start picking up your income, there could be a world when this debt is over that this is not 20, that this is 25% of your take home. You said, I'm saying that you raise your income and it becomes something that you can keep around today, though, it's really a problem. So I would say your homework to sit down with your spouse tonight would be to say, what are all the things we can do to make money? What are your opportunities that are directly related to your job and what are mine that do you both work? Yes, we both work. So he has the main job and then he has a part time job on the weekend to make some extra income. I try to work overtime. I work at a daycare. So I try to work extra overtime whenever I can. How consistent can that happen? Is that like a daily thing or is it like a couple times a month there? It varies. It depends on the teachers. Like I just found out I have COVID so I have to be out all week. Got you. So when I be looking for when I'm looking for a side hustle, I'm looking for something I can count on. That's the whole point. So I'd be looking if I'm going to spend the extra hours working, I want something that's like clockwork, I can get it, I can go bust my button, do it and it's there. So you both need that. And then if something, part time pops up at the job and you have the place on your schedule to do it, you do that too. But right now I want here's my main job and a go to side hustle that's always there. I can work it every day, every weekend, got it. So that's you guys' job to come up with that tonight. And then after that, have you made a budget? I tried the dollar thing. I just downloaded it. Okay, good. I did like the free trial thing, but I'm going to have the test of the cause like $18 a month. Okay. No need to stop borrowing money. Yeah, you guys stop borrowing. We want to do it. We can do it. Yeah, right. Like you got in this mess because y'all are trying to do too much and you don't have enough money for it. So if you can't afford every dollar to get a budget, you better get it out on paper. You can afford it. You spend more on pizza delivery. Okay. You can afford it. This is the Ramsey shirt. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio alongside Jade Worshaw and Ken Coleman. Dustin is going to start us off here in New York. Dustin, how can we help today? Hi there. Thanks so much for taking my call. You bet. What's going on? We have a question about housing and budgeting. Let me give you a little bit of context. My wife and I are in our early 30s. We've been working in baby steps. We've been married about two years and in about the year and a half mark we paid off. We finished paying off around 70,000 worth of debt. Way to go. Thank you. We currently live in a one-bedroom co-op in the Hudson Valley which costs us around $1,600 a month. With that in our budget, we're able to save between $3,000 and $4,000 a month. We've been doing that since we got married. We're about to have, we have a seven month old now and coming May, we're going to have our second child. That's a lot of people to put in a one-bedroom apartment. To get to a bigger place would be about $2,400 a month at least in this area just because it's the Hudson Valley. Our childcare costs are likely to go up in the coming August once paternity and maternity relief is done. My question is like do we stick it out here? Our long-term plan is to move out of state in about two years once my mother-in-law retires and so we're saving up for a down payment. What's the meantime? That's my question. Indiana, we want to go to Indianapolis. In about two years? In about two years. How much money have you got saved up? We currently have around 17,000 saved up. We just finished paying off all of our debt so we're like we're just getting started on that saving process. But you're saving along per month which is great. Yeah, yeah exactly. Our living situation really helps with that and we got family nearby and all that so the location is good. It's just the square footage is not great. So do I sell our co-op in the meantime so that during that two year waiting period we can have a more expensive but larger place or do we just kind of stick it out in the one bedroom with four people? I mean if I would, what I would do is I'd stick it out for as long as I possibly can because the more that you can save on your living is the more money that you can save for a potential down payment. And I don't have to tell you you need a lot of money saved for a down payment these days. So the more that you can get saved in the next two to two and a half years that would be my number one goal. Matter of fact I'd run it back and say okay based on Indianapolis home prices and based on what we want. Which I got you over here whenever you're ready. Let's get ready. Yeah, we're going to plug that in and then we're going to run it back and say okay what must be true for us to move in? And that's that that is the silver bullet of what we're saving for in the next two to two and a half years. Okay, I'm your assistant. I'm giving you some numbers. Well, my computer died so I don't have it. Okay, I got you. All right, you got it. So what I'm here for. All right, so an Indianapolis. So average price for a three bedroom home. I did three bedroom because it's going to feel like a castle to him. Love it. Oh, I love hearing the little one in the background. That's real. We liked that folks. 230 to 299. Okay, this approximately 230,000 to 299,000. Some specifics. If you look at Marion County, because I typed in greater Indianapolis area. So I'm given. So this is just what this is the homework you need to do, my friend. But you got Marion County median prices. 229 Hendrix County median prices. 303 Johnson County median price is 298. So let's add some. So you. So 300 to 300,000 and then let's add a little inflation to that. Let's say 240, right? That's what I would say because this is two and a half years from now. So you say 240 and then knowing that what you're attempting to do is put 25% down, then you can go and unplug and estimate the taxes and insurance and all of that. And that number is what you need to be. Well, I got him. I got him at if you guys continue to save if I was listening correctly, you were saying saving three to four thousand a month. You guys can have a shot of getting close to a hundred thousand just your savings, not including any equity in the co-op, right? Correct. Yeah. So I what's your equity in the co-op? We think based upon comps that I run in the area that I can get around 54, 50 after the sale. So that brings us pretty close to that 20% down payment with what we have saved. Right. And we're targeting a house in Indianapolis around the 300,000 mark. Correct. Love that. Love it. That's very doable. And I'm a jade then. Listen, the babies don't know. This is going to be tough on you and mom, but you know what? Two little babies. These are going to be memories that you two talk about when the kids are long gone. Of course. And you're going to be like, we did it. And I think since we're not asking the kids to suffer, you guys aren't really suffering, but it is a form of suffering. And I'm with my partner on this one. She, listen, she and Sam, I brag about this. She had seen I had one car for how long? Ten years. And how many years after you actually had the money to buy a car? Oh, long. Let's see. So we were done in 2018. I didn't buy a second car till we got here, which was 2022. Which I don't recommend. I think she's bananas, but she's the real deal. So I'm with jade. I 100% would suck it up. They're little ones. It's going to be crazy in a way. Two years is going to fly when you get two babies. I know that's right. The days are long, but the years are short. That's right. And I'm with jade 100%. I tough it out and then make the triumphant entry into Indianapolis with a really, really nice down payment. And by the way, cost of living there. Fantastic. And you're going to feel like from Hudson Valley to the greater Indianapolis area. Oh, man. What a change. Unless we can for example, wait a second. Hold on, Dustin. She's got an idea. No, it's not an idea. I was just about to throw some bait into the water. Go for it. I was going to throw. You said it's a really great cost of living there. And I was going to say unless everybody, unless everybody in New York gets spooked and not going to happen. Starts going to places like Indiana and Florida and Tennessee. Oh, yes. So people raising their hands out there. You know what I'm saying? Indiana is the new Tennessee. Are you all leaving? Are you all leaving upstate New York? I met you all earlier. Is that what you did? Yeah. See? That's what I'm saying. Now I'm not trying to spook you, but I'm just saying the migration is real. They're more mature. Can we say that? They're a little bit more mature in age. I'm just saying that they're our predictions being made. I'm just saying about another great migration. Oh, well, we'll see. We'll see. Times will tell. Now's the time, folks. I thought I was setting you. That's why I said I was putting in line in the water. No, I'm not going to take it. I'll say this. I'll say this. I, when people say they're going to leave this country based on some political change. Number one, is there right to say it? We saw a lot of celebs say it. A few actually did it. Instead they just went to Indiana. They went to England. Oh, the celebrities. I'm thinking of. Yeah. But, you know, listen, are people going to leave over stuff like that? You better believe it. So massive migration from California. We saw it here in the Tennessee. Certainly a lot of people moving to Florida. It's certainly going to happen. But I don't think, and my brother-in-law and sister-in-law live in Indianapolis. So I apologize had a time. Of all the places people are going to flee from New York, I don't think it's Indianapolis. I'm not throwing shade at any of my friends. It's like, nice area, sir. It's a lovely area. But it's not on the top of anybody's list. Is that fair? Even he's acknowledging me. He's like, well, you make a good point. Lovely place to live. Is it a top destination? I don't think so. I know life gets busy. The to-do list never ends, but some things are just too important to put off. And making a will is one of them. That's why I recommend Mama Bear Legal Forms. Because I've seen it too many times. Families are grieving a loss. And on top of that, they're stuck in court fighting over paperwork. All because someone didn't take a little time to get their will in place. That's not what you want for your loved ones. You want peace. You want clarity. You want focus on what matters most, being present and leaving a legacy. With Mama Bear, you can create your will in just 20 minutes, right from the comfort of your home. It's simple, legally binding, and doesn't require an expensive attorney or hours of confusing paperwork. And I'll tell you, almost every person who uses Mama Bear says the same thing. If I would have known how easy it was, I would have done it sooner. So don't wait, go to MamaBearLeagleForms.com and use the promo code Ramsey to save 20%. That's MamaBearLeagleForms.com code Ramsey. Hey folks, welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman and Jade Warshaw is in studio with me. Triple 8-825-225 is the phone number for us to coach you up. Should we lead in on the budgeting and what to do with the debt calls? I'm going to lead on how to make more money, how to move up in your professional life so we can make more money, more freedom. That's the theme there. So we'd love to hear from you. And how about a question from the Ramsey network, Ab. Jade, you up for one of those? Sounds good. Let's do it. All right. This is from Ann. She writes, I'm engaged and my fiance just bought an RV. Hmm. Four, you're ready for this? Hard swallow. $240,000. But he's not sure how he's going to pay for operating it. Yikes. What? I'm concerned that he may take a loan out. So he'll not only have a monthly payment but also all the expenses and upkeep that go along with owning an RV. My question is, how do I proceed? Because we plan to get married next year and we disagree on money issues. Yikes. Oh wow. Yeah, that's a big red flag. Get it? Do it and bought an RV. I don't think I realized that RVs were this expensive. Oh man. Yeah. That's a house on wheels basically. Oh yeah, okay. But doesn't go up in value. Right. Drop it. Lack of rock. Drop, dropping like a rock. Okay. You should be concerned. The fact that she's concerned that he's going to take a loan out makes sense. He took a loan out for the RV. So yeah, I hope I take a loan out for the upkeep. The biggest issue is they don't agree on the money issues. Ken, I don't know about you. I believe that money is one of those big overarching themes. You've got to be aligned on its money, politics, religion, and how you see raising your kids and family, that kind of thing. I agree. And so this is a big one. The best way I think to call this out is just to sit them down and say, listen, here's what we've said our plans are together. We obviously plan to get married. I've started noticing that you and I have different views on how we view money and how we view debt. Can you tell me a little bit more of how you see that playing out in the future? And maybe just kind of set them up with some questions. Hey, in the future when we want a car, what do you think we would do when we try to save up a pay cash or do you think we would take out a loan and just kind of ask him learn more about what he would say. And then you, once you've heard his response, then you come back and say, okay, well, here's my viewpoint. I think that if we were going to buy cars, I'd like to pay cash. And here's why. And then lay out your side and say, I just want to have a clear conversation and see, is there a way that we can get on the same page with this because this feels like it caused problems down the line and I don't want that for us. And you just have to have a hard conversation. Yeah, I agree with everything you said. I'd probably ratchet up the technique here. Tell me. Yeah, I'm going to go with the, he needs a text. What do you mean? I'm going to tell you. You're going to text them the questions? No, I'm going to text him and say, okay, I'm going to text them. And say, we need to talk. Okay. Now you know that. That strikes fear. If you didn't have bubbles in your tummy, when you receive that text, you will have bubbles. You need bubbles. We need bubbles. This is a, we need to tell us. This is a bubble's level conversation. Oh, man. So you want to create uncomfortability going in. He needs to know how serious it is. Okay. This is not a manipulative power play. It is a, we need to talk. It's time to define the relationship. Because she says in this question, I am really concerned that we don't see eye to eye. And I think I agree with everything you said, I just would put some seriousness on it. It's not a threat. Serious sauce. Yeah. It's not manipulation. I'm just saying it needs to be, I don't know that we should be talking about getting married. Or no, no, I don't know. We shouldn't be talking about getting married. If we can't get this on the phone. We've got to press pause on this, because this will break us down the road. And this is nothing to do with my feelings for you. I think it's that serious. Okay. So I'm approaching this as if she were my daughter. Okay. But here's, let me push on this a little bit. There we go. This is why people show up. Let me push on this a little bit. I would be afraid because love goggles can make you change parts of yourself. Can you, and this is embarrassing, but give me a real quick 15 second on what love goggles means. I think I know, but I'm not sure I've ever used it. But you see, you see, I think, you know, the little things that you get married, you'll start to notice. Okay. So you think she's got love goggles? Yeah. She did. She doesn't now. No, she doesn't. But my point is, if he has love goggles on, if she makes it feel like an ultimatum, then he might change some of his answers in order to get what he wants. And I'm not saying maliciously, you're like in a diabolical. I'm just saying that sometimes the pressure, yes, because the truth is you are your best self when you're in your dating phase. You're your best, like you're on your best behavior. And so he could be like, oh, yeah, yeah, honey, you know, we don't have to do that. So you think my approach helped me, how's my approach? Not how does she then make it serious? Because I think if she makes it, I think if she just makes it a conversation and we're talking, she's more likely to get the real answer. But if she puts the stress, we need to talk. We need to define this relationship. Then he could feel the need to be like, well, okay, okay, yeah, no debt, no debt, that's fine, that's fine. But that may not be really where his heart is. That? I know. Okay. So, okay. So let's say I go with your approach. I'm not there yet. Okay. Fair enough. Let's say she has that conversation and then there's no real outcome. Then I think she can ratchet it up. I think I would start. Are you okay with that? A little more casual. You like my plan. You just aren't ready to push that button. Yeah. We're on like level two and you were coming in hot on like medium high. That's fair. And I'll, and listen, I can now say, I understand that, but you know, I was truly coming at it from, if it's your daughter. If it's my daughter and she's having this conversation, she says, dad, what would you do? I went dad. I pushed the dad button, everybody. Oh, and Jade. Thank you for pulling me off of it a little bit. If it was my daughter, I'd be like, let me go talk to her. Oh, okay. Hello. You just took me and said, hold my beer and I'm going to, I'm going to kick the door now. All right. All right. Very good. But you get my point. I think I would say this. I think you said it well. And I want to, I want to park it here. Okay. Can we park it? Yeah. That's a good question. Because here's why you nailed it on the things that cause marriages to, to splinter and unfortunately break you, you gave a whole list. Kids, faith, politics, money. Yeah. And, and, and, excuse me, and to that point, we have a lot of new people that are joining this program all the time. Yes. I'm, I'm, I'm parking it here because I think it's important that we share with people why this actually happens. There are deep seated habits that come from beliefs, the environment on all of those issues. You can pick any of this. We're only talking money right now. But when, when, when you have two, when you have two completely different value sets, and you mentioned love goggles, let's just talk about money goggles. Okay. If the two sets of goggles in a way you see money are so different, it literally can cause chaos in your relationship. True or false? Is that too strong of a state? No. I think that's exactly right. How does it cause chaos? Well, you know, think about it. One is, let's, let's filter it through the question. She is a person obviously a little bit more frugal. She sounds like she's dead averse. She sounds like she understands the value of keeping your income every month. And that might be because it, all of that belief is because of how she's experienced the world up until this point. And then he's the opposite. I'm not saying he's a bad guy. I'm just saying that his beliefs are based on how he's experienced the world up until this point. And when you want somebody to change what they believe based on how they've experienced the world, that is a hard way. That is a hard fought fight. Yeah. It's their default mode. It's their default mode. So you, it's not just as simple as we'll change. Well, I got to go back in and I got to figure out how do I feel about this and what does that mean about me because I've always operated like this because of this. So it's not just a surface level request. That's right. Hey, I don't want to use debt anymore. Oh, okay, no problem. Like it's, it's never that these are, and that's why I say when it comes to these money issues, we do say can. Sometimes it might sound a little bit flippant. Get on the same page with your money. Yeah. And the point is it's not a light switch that you just flip up or flip down one day. It's a journey. I agree. And I would say on all those issues, I think all those issues should come up in premarital counseling. Can I just put that out there? But I certainly believe money ought to just press pause. Don't get married until you get on the same page with this stuff. I think you're safe yourself. A ton of stress and everything else, my goodness. It's that important. Just a little relationship. We talk about this. Relationships and money folks, you just cannot untie those. They are tied together whether you like it or not. So really good stuff. All right, quick break. Don't move. More calls. They're all lined up, folks. We're going to get to them. This is the Ramsey show. Don't let big grocery bills spoil your holiday plans. Shop at Aldi first. They've got USDA choice meats like beef pork and even your turkey along with fresh produce, holiday desserts and more. And you'll find all of them at the lowest prices of any national grocery store. A family of four can save up to $4,000 a year by shopping at Aldi. You don't need a membership or some loyalty app either. So stop overpaying this holiday season. Go to Aldi.us to find a store near you. That's Aldi.us. Savings based on regional analysis of Aldi versus select competitors. Prices may vary by location, product availability and the market. Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside Jade Worshaw. I'm Ken Coleman, triple eight, eight, two, five, five, two, two, five is the phone number. It's time for our question of the day. It comes to you by and from our good friends. YRIFI, YRIFI refinances defaulted private student loans and builds a custom loan based on your ability to pay. You'll have a payment that you can afford with a low fixed interest rate. You can't get anywhere else. So this will help you stick to your budget and work your debt snowball. Go to YRIFI.com today. Slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y-R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey may not be available in all states. Already then, you have to turn your microphone on. I don't know. I don't know how that works. Okay. Today's question comes from Tyrone in New Jersey. He says, I work for a small company with less than 20 employees. Recently, I discovered that while my employer has been taking deductions from my check for my 401k, they have been holding the money and making a few small deposits into my account throughout the year and then one larger deposit at the end of the year. Huh. The front of my employer and their only response was that they were sorry. Does this sound legal or unethical and is it time to seek new employment? Yes. That does not sound right. I'm going to show you that. It does not sound right at all. It smells very fishy. Yeah, because you're missing out on time in the market if they are not investing the money into the funds that you chose. This needs to be dealt with instantly. Instantly. Like sitting down with lots of leaders going, hey, look, I immediately got questions. I'm going to go in accusing, but a lot of questions and good questions. Good questions. Why has this been happening? Yeah. You said sorry that implies a mistake. Has it been remedied? What are you going to do about all the back stuff? There's a lot of things. But what's the tone? I need to know tone because I haven't a strong tone. I'm going to say serious tone. A serious tone. I'm not messing around here. Oh, yeah. Very serious. Yeah. I like that you asked this. So I want to set this up well. The questions themselves take care of the tone. In other words, you don't have to be accusatory, angry, a really pointed specific line of questioning. Uh-huh. Prethought out, maybe right there in front of you on your lap or on your phone. And in the moment, the, your serious, serious face, we're not joyful about this. No, no smiles. No amiableness. Yeah. It is serious. But I think the questions asked properly make it very serious. They go, this is a person who did their homework. This is a person who has follow ups. There is a line of questioning. They feel as though they are on a witness stand. And that's how it should be. You don't have to be ugly and accusatory because you're hoping to get to the bottom of this and get an actual solution. But like doing this, you're going to find out really quick if this is a fishy situation or if this is a fixable situation. That would be my take. I don't like that. I love a furrowed brow, but a nod, yes. Like, yeah. That way, first question. How did this happen? Yeah. Okay. And stop talking. Yes. How did this happen? That's a serious question. Then the follow up is, has it been fixed? Will this ever happen again? What happens to the money that I earned that should have been put like these questions? That's the real question. These questions are going to imply a whole lot of seriousness. That would be my posture. And spoken from a guy by the way who's not done it well. All right. I mean, because I get, I get how the heat should be pretty hot under the hood there. It should be steaming. But can we keep that in? And can we ask the questions that way? That helps us hopefully get some real response. I hope so. Yeah. This would be, this needs to be dealt with. Do you see, I almost might seek an employment lawyer on this. Not lock up a lot of time, but maybe a consultation. I don't think I, I mean, don't give me wrong that this is not the type of thing that would ever happen here. But let's just pretend I looked at my investments and said, wait a minute, like my thing didn't go in there. I mean, I would go to my leader and, or, you know, who's over HR or whatever and say, hey, here's what I discovered. I would not be loyering at this point. I'd be doing what you're doing, which is asking a serious question. This is the thing that they've already apologized and so essentially, we have an admission of, we have an admission of guilt here. At this point, that's why I'm saying. So that's why I'm saying. So that's why I'm saying. So that's why I'm saying. But the next round, and if I see it again, because my thing is, if I see it again, then yeah. Well, I'm sorry, I should have done a better job asking you. If you know you've got to go have this conversation with a leader, which they do, I might consult an employment. Yeah, I probably would. Just at that point. So I know what should be. That's, this is, you know what I mean? This is very fishy. Give me a look. Listen, I don't want to say, do anybody wrong, but they took the loan. It smells over there. That was a loan. I got it. Let's go to Denver, Colorado next. We're David awaits. David, how can we help? Hi, I'm starting to work the, well, I'm working baby step two and I have been using a credit card for all of my like day to day purchases and I pay that credit card off every month, but I'm looking to stop using it. And I'm just a little hesitant to like start carrying a balance so that I have like the money to just use the debit card for other things and then like have to carry that as I pay that one off to and so just like paying it off. And so I'm not sure like is it something where I should like wait a month or two and save up the extra money or should I just go and carry the balance and pay it off as quickly as possible. So okay, let me filter it through the baby steps. So when you're paying off debt using the debt snowball method, what we say to do is you pay minimum payments on everything so that you're satisfying whatever your debts are for that month, you're paying, you know, you're doing the things on your budget that are necessary for that month, whatever they may be. I mean, everybody pays their rent or mortgage, you pay your groceries, you pay your minimums on your debt. And then the extra money after that goes to paying off your smallest debt. So you do need to satisfy with your own cash the things that the month requires and which for you, that's going to feel some type of way because you're used to doing that with your credit card. So essentially, you're used to taking all of your income and throwing it to your credit card to paying it off. In this month, you're going to go, no, I'm going to take my income and I'm going to use it on my life and what the margin is I'm going to use to pay off that credit card and what you're going to discover there when you do that is what has been true all along, which is that money was debt and you were borrowing it and now you owe it and have to pay it back. That's what that's going to feel like. You're going to actually feel that you've been in debt this whole time. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah. Listen, I'm proud of you. I'm glad that you're seeing, you've seen the light. You've had that moment. What caused you to go, you know, I don't want to do this anymore? It's just like, it's a little hard to plan like when you're the bill is finished on the 20th of the month, but you don't pay for it until the 15th of the next. So it seems a lot easier to manage the other way. Well, listen, I want you to have every dollar. That's going to be a great way for you to make this transition into using your own money. Let me just say, and I know you can speak to this, when you have been a person who you've let credit cards run their scam on you, which what credit cards do is they say, hey, we'll make your life easier for you, easy in the word, in quotes. But what it really does is it steals your confidence to handle your own money. That's what it does because you have this crutch that you've been relying on. That's always there. It's debt, but you don't feel like it's debt. And then the moment you remove it, suddenly most of us are like, oh my gosh, I don't even know what to do with my own income. It feels exposing. And so that you're going to feel that for a moment and then you're going to go, oh wait, I actually make money and I work hard for my money and I should have the dignity of managing it and spending it in and of my control. Okay. There you go. And what will change is, I was waiting for him to respond because the emotion there, he's looking at his wounds. He really is. But I love that he told you why this, why the call, why the change, the stress of living off of that credit card way that a lot of people do that. Well, I'm going to use it for this and then pay it off of them. And for him, he's not wired for that. Yeah. And I'm just thinking about how light he's going to feel. Yeah. You know, when he just starts to do it this way, the way you've told him and he goes, okay, now I am in full control. I don't have that angst. And you're not behind a month. When you do that, you're always behind a month. And so what happened? That's the feeling. You put everything on your American Express and then what happens if you lose your job? Now you just owe the money but you didn't get your paycheck. So there's, there's method to the madness people. Yep. Good stop. Thanks for the call, David. It's going to work. Take a deep breath. Maybe three or four. And it's going to be great. Alright, don't move. Quick break. More of your calls coming up. She's Jade Warshall. I'm Ken Coleman. You're listening to The Ranze Show. Hey guys, it's open enrollment time for health insurance. And if you have ever felt overwhelmed trying to figure out your health care costs, you are not alone. For a lot of families, health care is one of the biggest line items in the budget and it gets more confusing every year. But you don't have to settle. Human health care ministries is a biblical and budget friendly alternative to health insurance. And I am proud to recommend them with CHM. You are joining a community of believers who actually help share each other's medical bills. Yes, true. Members have shared over $12 billion in health care costs since CHM started nearly 45 years ago. And it's simple. You choose your provider with no network limits. You submit your eligible bills online and other members help share your expenses. CHM has program options for every stage of life, whether you're single, self-employed, or raising a family. Y'all open enrollment has a lot of people scrambling right now. But CHM lets you join anytime. So go to CHministries.org slash budget to check them out. That's CHministries.org slash budget. Welcome back to the Ramsey show. I'm Ken Coleman-Jade Warshaw is in studio with me. Triple eight eight two five two two five thrilled to have you with us. We're here to coach you up. Let's go to Brandon in Minneapolis, Minnesota, Brandon. How can we help today? So I just enrolled in an HSA this year and I'm wondering if it makes sense. Okay. I had a couple of a couple of hospital visits pop up this year and I'm anticipating the same thing next year. Okay. So even with the compounding interest, I'm spending thousands of dollars each year. Does it make sense to still hold on to the HSA? Well, it depends. I mean, when you do know that you're going to have qualified medical expenses, it could make sense to pay for them through the HSA and in that way you're not you're not taxed on that money. So that could make sense for you. So you're thinking about it more through the lens of your actual health purchases. You're not thinking about it as an investment vehicle, which a lot of our colors do. Correct? Well, no, I am looking at it as an investment vehicle. I'd like to have it in retirement. Oh, okay. Well, in that case, an HSA is a great idea if you know that you don't go to the doctor much, if you're willing to have that higher deductible because maybe you know that you're not going to meet it, that could be great for you. And then of course, if you're thinking about it as a retirement vehicle, that's great, but it would not be my first choice. It would be what I would do, maybe tertiary to a 401k or a Roth IRA and then I'd go in and do an HSA. Have you already maxed out those other options? I have not. Okay. So yeah, I've been paying for everything out of pocket so far. Okay. So if we're looking at it through the lens of strictly investing, yeah, I'm starting with a 401k. If I have it through my work, you know, start with that. If there's no match, you start with a Roth IRA first. Now for the use of, hey, I want to filter some of my actual health expenses through this, then yeah, you could fund it up to the point of, yeah, I know that I'm going to spend, I don't know, $3,000 on health care this year. So I'm going to put that in there and then I'm going to use that HSA to then pay for those expenses. You could 100% do that. But I would not over fund it to the point of investing. Does that make sense? Yeah. Okay. So it's set up weird where I have to have $2,000 in the regular HSA and then everything above and beyond that can invest. Yes. And if you know, hey, at this point, the $2,000 that are in there, I'm actually going to use that on health care, care costs this year. And this is a great funnel for it. Yeah. I'm all for that. Because you over funding it to the point that you can then invest the rest, I would not do that until I've over funded my 401k in Roth IRA. Make sense? Yeah. And I'm, you know, giving the max up to the match for the 401k and I'm slated to max out the Roth IRA. Okay. Great. Good for you. Yeah. And if you do all three of those, you are what's known as winning at life. That's amazing. Yeah. Congratulations. Thanks for the call. Well, by the way, speaking of winning at life, you dropped tertiary out there. I want to just give a little shout out to that. That's a great word tertiary. Yeah. Yeah. That's a word, by the way, you figure out how to use that right, drop that in a sentence this week. Uh, you get a good brand at work. So there you go. Just call that out. Thanks for the call. I was impressed tertiary. Yeah. Very nice. Word of the day. Conner's up next in Boston. Connor. How can we help? Hi, Ken. Hi, Jade. Love you guys. Thanks so much for taking my call. You bet. What's going on? So my wife and I just got married. We're in the process of combining our finances and I basically have a retirement question. Okay. My question is, should we convert the money that we have in our traditional 401k's into Roth? Mm-hmm. Or should we just from this point forward put money into the Roth 401k option? Okay. What baby step are you in? We're in baby step 3B. We're currently renting. And we're going to be renting for the next couple of years because we're not going to be in the city that we're in long term. Yeah. I mean, how much do you have? Can I ask you a question? How much do you have in your 401k? Yeah. So across my wife and my accounts, we have about 220,000 in there. Our household income is about the same. Okay. Good. Very good. Typically, we would wait until baby step 6 to make a roll over like that because the truth is you're going to be on the hook for some taxes associated with that. Obviously. Right. And with the goals that you have up until this point, in this case, it's saving for a down payment, it could really eat into that goal that you have. So for this matter, you may, you know, yeah, from this point on, I would do Roth style. That's what I would invest in. But I probably would wait to roll it over until you're ready to fit the tax bill and that it's not going to put a dent in your other very important goals. So yeah, you could wait till baby steps 6 to do that. Okay. Great. Thank you very much. Absolutely. Love that call. They're rocking. Yeah. Spokane, Washington near your birthplace. Isn't that right? The city where, hey, before we go to Spokane, let me go back to that because somebody might be like, why do they want to do that? What's the purpose? Oh, okay. So they're 401k that they have now. They have not paid taxes on that money, right? And what they're trying to set themselves up for is a situation that when they get into retirement, they can pull money and not have to pay taxes on it. So if you do a Roth account, you're paying the taxes upfront so that when you're 59 and a half and older, you can pull money from that and not taxed on it. So most people would like to carry that burden now instead of waiting for later. So that's the purpose of that. And whenever you attempt to move that money that you have not yet paid taxes on it, well, then you will have to pay taxes on it. Okay. Yeah. Okay. All right. Randy's up in Spokane, Washington, Randy Huckabee Hill. Hi, Ken. Hey, I was recently let go in my mid 50s from an executive position making more of a 200 grand a year. And since I'm completely debt free, everything. And I have a pretty good nest egg set aside investment wise. I'm thinking about making that career change. To start out, I'd be making maybe 50 a year to first couple of years. And then later on, you know, it goes up, but it's something that gets me out of the corporate stress and the hassle. I don't have to move to right down the road to my house that's completely paid for. That's not weird. No, it doesn't sound weird given what you just experienced. I mean, when you lose a job like that, that is a real shot. We know from psychology studies that it's the equivalent of losing a loved one. So number one, I'm sorry that happened to you. Number two, it's not weird for you to be thinking through this. My first question comes down to the transition phase. So financially, can you make ends meet making this pivot to the $50,000 a year deal? And then how long would you have to live in that situation? Yeah, so I'm cash flowing it all out. And I have access to about a quarter million dollars in cash outside my 401k investments across all that. So my thought is that while I learned this, learned this new career path, you know, maybe I paid myself three grand a month out of that month of cash that I have. And you know, we just, okay, so that's what we're doing before. Right. So that's 36,000. J9 are keeping track of the money. So, so, and would that, would that then get you to a place where we've gotten margin? If you used 36,000 of the 250 that you got set aside. That's what my, that's what my spreadsheet told me. Okay. Now, what is the, I'm just curious. What is this new path? Being a surveyor, a life and surveyor. Okay. And so, how much would, is it, excuse me, is that a government job? Is that like a county level, state level? Or is it private? No, it's actually, it's actually, it's a little private company that they have their own own firm and, you know, they run, they run a little business. All right. So, 50,000 a year for how long before it goes up and then what does it go up to? Probably, probably the first couple of years and then, and then as you get more experience in your running your own jobs and everything, it gets into the 70, 80, 90 grand a year. Yeah. Well, that one is just, just me and my wife. And you've got, in your investment situation, you started off the call saying your investment situation is good. In this situation, I'm okay with this. I just wouldn't limit myself just to the, to the 50,000. I'd be doing some other stuff in the meantime because I really don't want to use any of that 250 I've set aside. That would be my advice. If you love it, and you can make that change, then I'm okay with it. It's not my favorite idea, but not a bad idea. This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Winds Credit Union Studios. Alongside Jade Worshaw, I'm Ken Coleman. And we're going to go to Matt, who's joining us now in Fort Worth, Texas. Matt, how can we help today? Right, yes, sir. So as of this past Monday, I had a truck that I'd been paying on for about two years. I had an auto loan for about $30,000 on it. I owe about $23,000 on it and the motor blew up. It's unfortunately just a bad design from General Motors. They've had issues with this vehicle or these motors for substantial amount of years at this point. And I am now calling victim to said bad design. It would be about $15,000 to have a motor replace. And I'm trying to decide what's my best option for it before I try to go trade it in and then it would be upside down on it. You owe $23, yes sir. If you get the motor fixed, if we could snap our fingers and it was just fixed today, and it was paid off, is this a truck you'd be happy to drive for a while? And could you? The truck's in great condition other than that. It does motor word to be fixed. There is a company that sells a motor that has the system that caused it to have this issue in the first place deleted. And that's the option that I went and got quoted from when I talked to a shop. Do you have the $15,000 in cash? I do not. What do you have in cash? I don't have much. My girlfriend just finished school and I was basically the primary provider for about a year and a half with us. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. How old are you? About 30 years old. You're 30, okay. You complimented you. You sounded much younger. You did. You did. Why are you the primary provider for your girlfriend? You guys aren't married. You're 30, too? No, she will be under me. How old is she? She is 27. You really don't know how old she is? You had to think about that. That's kind of funny to me. That's a different issue. That's a whole nother deal. Okay. Different show, different show, but I'm going to go ahead and tell you you probably need to be on top of that one. Okay. You should, so you need to come up with 15 grand. What do you make? I work in public safety. So last year I made about 70,000. I'm totally on track through about the same this year. And if you weren't helping provide for your girlfriend, it's just you, right? Just rent or do you own a home? I mean, what's the situation there? No, it would just be rent in my normal expenses. And I'm sorry for following up on this. Is she able to support herself now? Yes, she's working full time again. I just started with the school year. Jade, I, she works as a American time lunch interpreter and she started interpreting with a school. Yeah. All right, Jade, I don't know where you're at on this, but there's a part of me that goes because he's already upset down in this. The trade-in option to me is just foolish. You're just not going to get anything at all. I'd rather see him working two, three, four jobs and come up with 15 grand to get that truck fixed. And then, and then got a swallow of the pill and pay it off. But if it's a good, if it's if the trucks in good shape other than this defect, yeah. That again, I'm giving you the answer on what I would do. Well, yeah, I mean, if you roll out the numbers, if we, if we looked it up and said, what could you get for this with the bad engine? I mean, what is it? What would your fear? Do you have any idea? Yeah, I've been shopping around with a couple different dealerships. I reach out to GM recently because, or I'm sorry, GMC because they have the highest release and stuff right now because of what they say. GM would give me 9,000. Okay. And GMC would give me 9,000. I mean, because if you think about it like that and then you add what you would have to kick in to cover the upside down plus to get another vehicle. If you see what I'm saying, you're still selling out $15,000. So that's kind of the numbers on it. I can't see why you wouldn't just at this point, I hate it, but yeah, I don't think the numbers are good for you either way. So it's, do you want to keep the car and pay the $15,000 or do you want to get out of the car and get another beater, which I don't think you do. I think you'd rather drive them more than the nicer car of the two if you can just get the money. I tried that. You can't go into debt for this. I'll tell you that. If you end up, if you can't find the money and you end up having to go the other route of, you know, okay. Because here's the thing, if you do a personal loan to get from upside down, your numbers are going down and I can, I can advocate for that, right? I can advocate for you getting out of debt and then having to get a beater car and taking out a personal loan to do that, right? But I can't advocate for is you taking out a personal loan to keep a $23,000 car. That you were already in debt for. Does that make sense? So if you can't come up with the money, you might be going down and value. But I'm sitting next to a person who, who, with her husband, they had one car for how many years? A decade. So where there's a will, there's a way and what I'm saying is, is figure out a way to get where you need to get and I think you can come up with 15 grand pretty quick, a single guy who's able bodied. Now you might have to stop taking care of your girlfriend. Oh, well, that's done. I'm already assuming because she's just your girlfriend. She's a, she's a grown woman. You got problems. Yeah. So take care of her problems aren't, isn't your problem? Yeah, you can't. You know, in fact, you guys have been, you know, playing house for apparently a long time anyway. So no date nights, no nothing. You got to come up with 15 grand stat. Did we lose you? No, I'm sorry. Yeah, I know. It's a bitter pill to swallow. It is. But I just think the way Jade broke it down is great. And that just, again, we're always trying to answer things like, what will we do if you're in your shoes? Yeah. If you can't get the money without debt, yes, keep the car. It's good. It's, to your point, it's going to be a great car when you get it fixed. But you can't, you can't do debt. I can't let you take out $15,000 of debt to, and put it with a $23,000 debt. I can't let you do that. And you should say that to yourself too. And go back and listen to this call, right? Don't come off this call and go, oh, I can't get $50,000. I'm just going to marinate on it because when you do, you're going to see, oh man, the last thing I want to do is go from being $23,000 in debt, you know, to being $45,000 in debt. That would be terrible. I agree completely. Are you stunned? Yeah. I've tried going that route. I just haven't been able to find a place to be able to do that. I initially did attempt to contact my bank to try for a person long because other than the faulty design, I don't have an issue with the truck. I enjoy the truck. I've been driving in truck for two years and it's been great. So then what do you think your option is because you're either not getting the car fixed or listen, your other option is take the time. However long it takes you to save up the $15,000. And in the meantime, you're taking the bus and you're riding your bike and you're getting ubers and you're calling up Leroy to hit you up for a ride. That's your option. That's what I just want to think you got to do. Yeah. I don't think you like that option. I'm not even sure you heard that. I went through that feed stately. I think it went in one ear and out the other. Listen, it's not fun. That's why. Not fun. Hey guys Dave Ramsey here. Getting at money is 80% behavior and 20% head knowledge. What to do isn't the problem. Doing it is. In her brand new book what no one tells you about money, Jade Warshaw dives deep into the reasons you've been stuck. This book exposes the real emotional fight with money and shows you how to win that battle. Preorder now for $24.99 and you'll get over $100 of free bonus items. Get your copy today at RamseySolutions.com slash store. All right Jade, the all new every dollar is here and now it's way more than just a world class budgeting app. There's a ton of advanced features to help make faster progress with your money. I want you to imagine going on every dollar after going into your app store or Google Play and you get in there and you spend about 12 to 15 minutes answering specific questions and then right away like you were on the air with us. You get recommendations on where you can save money and it's several thousand dollars. That's right. Imagine that you got one of us always on call. That's what this app is. It's a game changer. The average person finds thousands of dollars in margin in the first 15 minutes. It stays with you. You are with it. It is the perfect partner. Start every dollar for free today. Get it in the app store or Google Play. It will absolutely be a game changer for you. Ashley is up next in Indianapolis. Ashley, how can we help? Hi. I'm a realtor. My commission actually goes through an LLC. We set up. I have a savings account where I have been putting my salary in. It's been really popular this past year. I really wanted to get clear. We're on baby step two. How should I be using that salary account? Should I put in six months and do it down and replenish it every quarter? Or should I have a full year salary in there before I started attacking the debt? I see. Are you the only... Is it just you or you said you're married, right? I am married. Does your husband work? He does. What do you bring in a year and what is he bringing in per year? This year I'm bringing in 130 and he's bringing in 40. What does it cost on annual basis? We can look at this monthly. Let's look at it monthly. What does it cost on a monthly basis to make your household run? 4,000. 4,000. Okay. What I would be doing is since you know that, it sounds like you're... Whenever you get a big lump sum of money, you're throwing it in savings and you're just kind of filtering in your portion of whatever makes the household run every single month. Is that right? Sort of. So all of my commission goes into the LLC checking account and then I put in what I know I need to get paid for the next couple of months, which is $2,000 a month. And that goes into our personal account. Okay. And then you're trying to understand, okay, with the rest of it, can I go ahead and start paying off debt or how much do I need to keep aside? Correct. Yeah. Like you should do like six months and then replenish it. How about we come at it? How about we come at it? What if we come at it a different way? How about you tell us how much you have in savings in our... excuse me, in the LLC account right now. Right now we've got 13,000 in total. Okay. And how much debt do you have and listed out for Jade's smallest to largest? Cool. So smallest to largest we've got five in school loans. Okay. Seven in a motor cycle. 21 in car and then 22 in credit cards. Okay. A few more questions about that. What's that motorcycle worth if you or he were to sell that today? He rides it in awful lot, so I don't know. It might be worth size. Okay. You notice I said if I get it, I get it. And it's such a small amount you guys could knock that out so we don't have to get rid of it. Okay. So Jade, you've got a picture of the debt right now. Mm-hmm. What do you have in the pipeline as far as home sales? So I have two that are pending past their contingencies. That'll be about 13,000 in the next 30 days. And then I also have five active listings. So what are you looking at? Maybe 20 more thousand. Okay. Okay. That gives you a better picture. Yeah. You've got 13 coming and then maybe another 20,000 in active listings. And there's already 13 there. I probably, if your husband made a little bit more money, I might pull this number back. But if I were you, I'd want like two months there. Does that feel right? Two months in the account to know that I'll be okay. Yeah. So instead of 13, you said 2,000 a month is what you pay yourself. So she's saying 4,000. 4,000. 4,000. Okay, leave five. Let's say five. And that gives you eight to put towards debt. Does that feel like and then on a regular occurrence that five, if it goes down, you're always replenishing it to where it's always five. You're paying yourself your monthly amount plus there's always five in the contingency account. Does that feel good? Okay. So more like an emergency account. Yeah. But I don't want it to be confused with your emergency fund. Because this really just is, it's kind of like if you have any other sole proprietor, you just want to make sure, hey, there's money coming in. I understand my income is very fluctuated. We would call this retained earnings and entrain leadership land, right? And so, but what we're also trying to do right now is trying to coach you up on what you can do with the 13 that's in there right now and make some headway. You've got a $5,000 student loan that you could knock out immediately. And we've done. And how much money would that free up in payment? Oh, 50 bucks. Okay, it's still 50 bucks. Still 50 bucks. 50 bucks is 50 bucks. Yeah. Which is great. And then the next month, my goal would be to knock out this motorcycle. Yeah. Okay. That's 12 grand. All though, over two months. Can I be honest? I'd sell the motorcycle. Well, I was going that direction. I'd get the two. I'd take $2,000 so that you're not upside down and I'd sell it. That's what I would do. But you said he rides it a lot. That's what the only reason I, you know what I'd do. I'd challenge him. Yeah. Yeah. I'd challenge him to go get a side hustle. What does he do, by the way, for $40,000 a year? He, so we actually live in Anderson, which is like a smaller market, but he is in training to become an electrician. So he is going to. Oh, okay. Okay, you know what for that? He can keep it. That's where I'm at. I, yes. Joy. I mean, excuse me. Actually, sorry, sorry, sorry. Actually, I think he keeps it. And you guys go all in on this and knock this, knock this out. But I knocked the student loan out today. I'd cut a check for five grand as soon as I got off the phone. Yeah, that's going to feel great. It's going to leave eight in there, Jade. Mm-hmm. And it's going to feel real good. Mm-hmm. Like that's a massive momentum. Yeah. And then put the other three on the motorcycle. That cuts that in half, essentially. And then the next month, so that means in December, the whole bike will be paid off. And now you guys will be setting yourself up to work on the credit card debt. Now is it one credit card for $22,000, or is it little or ones? No, it's, there's two, two basically, a half. Yeah. Okay, so, okay, great. So yeah, I would work on, right after that, yeah, now you got $11,000, $11,000 card in the next $11,000 card. You guys are going to go so fast like this. I love it. I love it. What's your anticipated timeline for him to start making the money as an electrician? I think you do for a reason six months, but about a year is when we'll actually know for sure when he'll get in there. I think you guys, if you really get after it, I mean, you're going to be a long way down the line here on paying off this debt by the time he comes into some really nice money. I think you're going to be done by the end of the year, because I think you're killing it on real estate. Yeah. Yeah. And I think the more this, for not having it done now, that's all right. No, it takes a minute to get the bearings on this. Let's say we're not playing armchair quarterback and looking in the back and looking in the past. Actually, this, you guys are a great young couple. This debt is very manageable. Yeah. I'm so proud of you. The thing that made me smile, by the way, Ashley is when you told me what was in your pipeline. You know, five houses sitting out there. Let's see if we can stack two or three more on top of that. That's a beautiful situation for you. And if he starts side hustling, yeah, mark my words in 12 months, you're going to be out of debt. He's going to be, you know, increasing his income greatly. You guys are going to be, it's going to be looking good for you. Right. Well, thank you guys so much. Yeah. We're going to be able to make a great shape. Head up, right? Super excited. Um, we're going to put you on the spot before we let you go. What are the chances, Ashley, that you cut a $5,000 check today to pay off that student alone? Hmm, 102%. Hey. Whoa. How about there? Oh, that's what I'm talking about. That's like a nice birdie plug clamp right there. Wow. I think that's fantastic. I love that. You know what I love about her? I love her. Forget it. Yeah. She said 102%. That's a nice check right now. That is. That's great. Uh, boy, that feels good, doesn't it? Describe for people from a person who, with your husband, you paid off half a million. What is it going to feel like to hurt? Describe the feeling for somebody's yet to do it. Oh, boy. Describe it. It's like nothing else because it's never comes back. It's a stress that never has the ability to come back in your life again. It's deleted. Like from the deleted files. Yes. Yes. Evaporated. Min and black. Every where you turn right now, you're being told a lie about money that you can't get ahead, that you can't survive without debt. And those lies are keeping you broke. Don't buy into it. Yes, there's a lot of noise and chaos and confusion out there. But there's also hope. The truth is you have more control than you think. This year, it's time to take back your hard earned money and your life. And it starts by joining our free live stream. On January 8th, me and Jade Warshot will show you how to go from chaos to clarity with your money. Help you break free from debt and change your family tree all by using the all new every dollar app. Yes, 10 people who sign up will win $2,000 cash. Don't let this be another year of I can't sign up for free at every dollar.com slash live stream. The rancid show rolls along from our national area base headquarters through the Chua with us. I'm Ken Coleman. And Jade Warshot is alongside the phone numbers, AAA 8255225. It's got a Chris and Sacramento, California. Chris, how can we help today? Hi guys, I just want to say thank you for hearing me out. I'm 27 and I'm getting married within a week. And I have debt, no debt, sorry, but 65% of my income is going to my house and we're grounding about negative 20% per month on our utilities and groceries and we've cut back and I'm debating on whether I sell my home, rent my home. I have an opportunity out area for a job that I would be able to live with free and just trying to take her out life. Wow. Well, what we know to be true is the 65,000, the 65% mortgage can't continue. So we know that's true, right? Right. So that kind of takes a way off of our shoulders to know, okay, we can't stay here. And then the question is, what do we do next? Because you said you've got an opportunity. Now we can start to say, okay, do we want to do the opportunity that's outside of the area? What does it look like? I think you mentioned renting this house. And so now let's talk about those other options. So is it fair to say that we both agree you can't stay in this house? Yes. Okay. So now let's talk about what do we do with the house? If I were you, I'd sell it. I'd gross about 150,000 and probably net at the real estate fees about 135. I like that. What's wrong with that? Nothing. It's more it's just my first home. I just put a hundred thousand dollars into it last two years. And you know, I was envisioning having my kids here. Yeah. So there's just the emotional connection to it. How long did you have the property? Two and a half years. I put about 150,000 dollars down on the house when I bought it. And I had a really good management position at a restaurant before. And that's where I'm going to now for the new opportunity. I tried to start my own business and I didn't work out exactly how I hoped. But I'm recuperating my losses. And I'm just trying to get back on my feet. I'm currently serving at a restaurant right now. And I've been getting by with that and me and my fiancee have just our net income together. It's just, we're not we're not making it. You're in Sacramento. Why are you guys staying in Sacramento for? It's like you're in a lot of shops that sound like you could do them really in any part of the country. Well, and that's where that's why we're moving it. It's just more of a do we rent the home and make a profit per month about a hundred two hundred dollars or do we sell the home, put the entire net into a money market account? Yes. And make about four hundred dollars a month on money market. Let's do the latter. Let's do the latter because if you have the opportunity to rent somewhere out of the area and they're covering the rent. This is an opportunity for you to start over. Let that money grow, that equity that you're going to get out of the cell of this home. Let it grow over time because the time is going to come when you want to buy again. I did I just I did have a math question on this because I thought I heard you say that you put a hundred and fifty down on the home. And then I also thought I heard you say that you put a hundred into it. Is that right? So you put two hundred and fifty into this home, but you're only coming out with one thirty five. What happened there? Bad contractor. I got really jacked up by that. I lost probably about fifty thousand dollars. Maybe more. And yeah, and I mean, I'm not a contractor guy. I was doing my job and I ended up going underneath the house and I just saw problems and I saw problems and I long story short cost me a lot more. And I was paying the mortgage at the same time as I wasn't living in it. So I was, you know, unfortunately paying devil. I see. Or a way. Yeah. So I just really drained this out of the night just paid off all my credit card that I had about seventeen thousand dollars in debt for completely debt free. That's excellent. I'm not a payment. Yeah. So there's there's some silver linings here. I think the hardest part is you had a vision for this house. You got taken for a ride and that sucks. And now as a result, you know, it's not going to be the house that you raise your family. But I love that you have other opportunities. And I mean, you can, you can, you're on the career side of this to weigh that out. I take advantage of that while you're on the line. Yeah. Well, Chris, if I heard you're right, you've got a really good manager gig you're heading into. So you feel good about this? Yes. I'm super calm. It's a nice restaurant and South Lake Tahoe. It's, it's a nice, it's like my dream job. Oh, fantastic. And did you say South Lake Tahoe? Yes. Oh, man. That ain't a bad place. Yeah, okay. Okay. Come on, Chris. And I'd be going for about, yeah, it just, it all makes financial say it. Yep. And it's just, yeah, I, I have, with my business, I've kind of had some regrets on that. And I don't want to have my cart in front of the horse. And I love it. You're asking the right questions. Jay gave you great advice. You do not want to be a landlord from long distance. This is time to move on. It's a clean start. And I think it's great for you. You're going into your dream job in one of the nicest places in the United States to live. And, and you kind of get free of this house, which has just been nothing more than a money pit for you. Unfortunately. So, yeah, sell and move on, my friend. Sell and move on. I love that. Do you want to take another call or can I highlight this for the people? Hey, I want to highlight this because a lot of times people are like, why does it have to, you know, we teach that the mortgage shouldn't be any more than 25%. And I know there's a lot of questions around that. And this is a really great, it's just a cautionary tale of what takes place when you don't heed that advice. Because if you really think about it, it, you know, if you look at your, your money as a, as a whole thing, you know, 100%. I love that you've got an orange for listening to the audience. She has a, she has a little tangy green in her hand. Yeah. And if you think about it as segments, right? We got to cut it up in a segment. It's going into segments. And so if you think, okay, if you do, let's pretend like, yeah, I'm taking your advice 25%. Okay. Now we got 75 left. And then it's like, okay, if you're a person who values generosity, most of us do. So you give them another 10%. Now you're at 35. And now you say, okay, well, you've got to invest, baby step four, I'm investing 15%. Now before you know, we're already at 50% of our income. And we haven't even paid our other bills yet. We haven't done child care yet. We haven't put aside for kids college yet. We haven't, you know, done taken a vacation. We haven't even done anything yet. And we're already out 50. So imagine what it would feel like if your mortgage was at 40%, or 45%. You feel that very, very, very, very quickly. So it's, it behoves you. It's a great word. You know, I like a good word. It does be who you to think about, okay, what are my ratios here? And is this sustainable long term? Because 65%. Like you said, they're burning 20% every single month. Ain't enough tangy rain left over. They're in enough. You got to eat the piss. By the time you do. That is fantastic. That's why I showed up today for that moment. That was good. Yeah, but it's a wonderful illustration. And then I want you to, while we're on this, also why we give him the advice of don't try to stay, don't become a landlord. Don't keep that house. Because you think, well, I'm going to make 400 bucks a month. I want you to walk through the math, the real math when people think that that's a good idea. Well, I think for him, it was more of a sunken cost fallacy. I feel like he thought, well, I've put this much into this property. If I hang on to it for a while and keep dumping effort or whatever it is into it, maybe I'll get it out. And for a lot of time, for a lot of us, that's kind of what keeps us locked in to something that's just a bad break. And you kind of have to just eat piss and go this. This was a bad break. It wasn't a good investment. I got taken for a ride and walk away. And for him, going all the way from Sacramento to South Lake Tahoe, and now you're going to be a long-distance landlord. Yeah, trust me. When he rolls in and that moving van to South Lake Tahoe, he's going to be like, I'm not, not going to Sacramento. Yeah. All right. But that's a difference. He's going to be like, forget you want to leave all that behind. Yeah, you want to leave it behind. Yeah. And he had a bad taste in his mouth. So I think for him to come out, he's clearing 135. It's not as much as he should. That's right. But it's still money. And it's going to sit in a high yield for however long until they're ready to buy. I agree. And when they buy, they're going to put as much down possible on a 15-year fixed rate mortgage, hopefully, that they can get paid off quickly. He's already debt-free. Yeah. And so the principle of this whole segment is, you know what it is? You've been saying it. Don't eat pith. There it is. Haha. By the way, spell that for people. PI pith. P-I-T-H, is that right? I think. I know. I could be a hidden letter in there. We did. We got validation. They guys in the booth. Great. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Think about the ratios of your income. Think about each section like this Clementine I hold in my hand. Oh, it's Clementine. It's even better. Mandarin. Love it. We're going to do this. Make sure it's a lesson. Felix, we'll go back to Sesame Street. You laid it out for us. I love it. Good stuff. All right. Quick break. She's Jade Warsaw. I'm Ken Coleman. We'll be right back. If you're holiday ham, tends to last longer than your New Year's resolutions, then I got a fresh challenge for you. Make this the year. You take control of your financial future with an actionable plan. Sound intimidating? You don't have to do it alone. Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside Jade Warsaw. I'm Ken Coleman. Our scripture of the day comes from Philippians 1, verse 6, God who began the good work within you will continue his work until it is finally finished. Our quote from Nathan W. Morris, the speed of your success is limited only by your dedication and what you're willing to sacrifice. Well, you can put that right on top of the baby steps. You could just lay it over. Factoids. That's really good. Love it. And Pennsylvania is where we go to see talk to you rather Leo. Leo, how can we help? So I'm having a problem. I make decent money at my job, but I can't seem to say it doesn't matter if I try separate accounts that aren't connected to my checking account. And I just cannot seem to save money to have an emergency fund to pay off debts. What happens? You transfer it over there and then you end up just peeping back in there and sneaking the money out? Yeah, yeah, I just keep dipping into it, whether it's for something important or just something that I want that's not important. I just can't seem to connect the dots between saving and not using it. All right, Leo. So I got a question. I'm asking this on behalf of my friend here. If we were following you around with a documentary crew for a week, what would be the top items that you're spending, the type of things you're blowing money on, you're spending the money on it for following you around, we'd go, oh, Leo, he's spending money on this. Give us a top five, just off the top of your head. Oh, it's gas station, energy drinks, hunting supplies, you know, things that I don't need. I was good. That was good. That's good list. Anything else? Not really. When I was younger, I was a, before I had kids and real responsibility, it was a, well, I'll make more money tomorrow. And I'm trying to carry that over now. And I can't seem to get away from that. You're in the outer and that spending habits. I got to ask another follow up, Leo. If I'm following you, all right, and we're in the gas station parking lot, we're zooming in on the doors and you're busting out of that thing. What do you got in the arms? What do you got in the old bag at the gas station? I'm curious. Oh, I heard you. Usually it's two to three energy drinks, maybe a snack for work and a can of tobacco. Dip corn nuts, Mountain Dew, right in it. Oh, man. That's disgusting. Say it's not true, Leo. Oh, it would be so. It is. I got to tell you, if I was on a desert island and the only thing I had was a bag of corn nuts, I stopped. Corn nuts. I really would. I would die. I actually do. So let's help them out with this budget, Jay. Okay. So I think I heard you say you had kids. Is that right? Yes. How many four? Okay. And you're married still. I'm not. You're not. Okay. We are dating. We are together. Don't you have married yet? Okay. So you have a woman that you're soon to marry. I'm. Yeah. Okay. Okay. So let's talk about the money first and then we'll go back to the relationship because we're not going to speed past that like you didn't just say what you just said. Four kids. Okay. So first off, what you really need, I think the solution here is a good detailed budget. I always say that budgets should be three things. You need to be able to build realistic and flexible and that will really help you out because I think what's happening like you said, you're kind of spending the money before you get it. And it's like, I can out earn this. I can out earn this. And if you don't, then you end up having to pull back out that savings. So we'll make sure that you get set up with every dollar. And what I want you to do, I want you to sit down and create your budget. And I want you to be so detailed about all the things that you know you spend money on. Even the energy drinks. You know that's something that's part of your life right now as it sits. Put it on the budget. If you know, hey, like I buy a hunting knife at least once a month, put it on the, like be realistic and honest with who you are in your spending so that you can begin to see, okay, I see what's going on here, right? So that's a good place to start. And then obviously the same way that you're budgeting for all the other things you budget for things like savings and you can actually see, do I have money to put aside in savings? And I live the lifestyle I'm living and still have money to put aside in savings. Right now it seems as though the answer is no, but when you do the budget, you're really going to get a clear picture of what's going on. So that's thing one thing to I haven't even asked you about debt yet. Do you have any debt? We have two vehicles that I pay for and I had maybe $2,000 of credit cards that I'm slowly working on paying off. Okay. Putting everything into perspective, right now if you do find extra money in your budget after you've budgeted for everything, right now the money wouldn't necessarily go towards savings, you'd save up $1,000 and that's it. If you can get $1,000 and just set it aside, tuck it aside for a rainy day, that's great. Everything else needs to go towards paying off this debt. Okay. Okay. Now let's talk about the elephant in the room with the relationship because I don't know why mom is not paying for her car. I don't understand it. I don't get it. Why don't you know why mom is not married? I don't get a school. Well, I'm with you on that. I'm as traditional as they get. Why aren't you guys just married yet? And it's 100% my fault. I am I want to give her everything that I possibly can wedding wise. Like I want it to be the wedding of her dreams. Yeah. With the money situation, I am not to that point where I'm comfortable spending that money on something like that. I hear that. So it's me holding back. She wants she's pushing for it, which I have no problem doing it, but I want it to be everything she wants. I don't want her to have to hold back on something. Listen, because we don't have the money for it. I 100% honor the idea that you want to give her a wonderful wedding party, but I want you guys to frame that as that's what it is. It's a celebration. It's a party. It married legally and don't nobody have to know, but you guys. And then you're at least protected legally. You know what? Huh? She's been looking into that. Do you think the court have things like that? Yeah. How about this? How about you guys just get married and then you can you can throw a celebration years from now or you can rededicate your vows and you she can put on the dress. I mean, spoiler alert, everybody is married before their wedding day. Everyone. The moment you get the document, the moment you go and sign the document. You had me there for a second. I was like, so the idea that it's like, no, I want to wait until the damn. Like we all get married on paper a week or so before we're actually married. That's right. So it's not even like we make it more of a thing than it is. So I think for you guys, like, yeah, get married on paper that way. You can do all the things we just talked about with your wife. Yeah. That sounds nice, doesn't it? Okay. It does. It does sound nice. Yeah. And then you guys can save up for this wonderful party. You can do all of it. How much do you think you're spending a month in energy drinks, bro? Oh, it's usually about $10 a day. Yeah. Okay. So we're going to do 30 days in a month. All right. That's $300. Oh, okay. My guy is Rick. Yeah. I'm telling you, man, you need to get rid of the energy drinks. That's a $300 a month raise. Do some push ups, some pull ups. All right. Get some good night's sleep. You won't need an energy drink. I don't need an energy drink. I wake up with the juice, man. Okay. I'm just telling you, I have a lot better coffee, but that's like two cups max energy drinks, two cups, not energy drinks. Those are the tors. Yeah. But I'm not getting on your health. I'm actually saying $300 a month. I wanted you to see quickly how you just changed your life. That's a big deal. That's a big raise for you. True or false? Well, you can get rid of the energy drinks. Don't get me started on the tobacco. Well, I'm flowing down on that. I know. I'm not worried about that. And that's why I didn't bring it up. I am trying to actually be sensitive. I get that one's harder to kick than the energy drinks. If you do this budget, I think you're going to be astonished. And especially when you share it with your new wife since you guys are getting married this weekend, I think you're both going to be astonished. And there's something about seeing your behavior on paper written out that you go, like, you clutch your pearls. I can't believe I've been spending my hard earned money on this when I could have this. And so the what you could have is what you and your wife, when the time comes, you need to be dreaming that up together. You're giving all this great financial advice. I'm trying to help him, but in a different category, you're my friend. You are Mrs. Clean eater. Give him some. No, you do a great job. Give him a healthy snack instead of the chips at the gas station. What's he taken to the office for a snack? Come on. I thought you asked this. Let me tell you what I'm on right now. You would like it. I take a Granny Smith apple. I love a Granny Smith sour. I sour. I slice it up. Right. So we got slices. Then I get a little. Tell me it's peanut butter. Jar of peanut butter. It's not just that. We are separated at birth. I know you look like it. Wait, I'm getting more. Hemp seeds. So I go apple into the peanut butter into the hemp seeds. Last, salted caramel. I don't know if I need to be that chilled out. Just a little bit of salted caramel. It is so good. Is the hemp seed going to knock his intensity off? No. Hemp seeds are, they're a complete protein. They're really high in protein. They're delicious. I'm learning something new every day. There it is Leo. There's your healthy snack. Man, we just saved you more money. Hey man. No more corn dogs. Put it in the cup holder. This is the Ramsey Show. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it. I'm going to eat it.