1KHO 692: Get Your Hopes Up | Danielle Kartes, You Were Always There

Oh, it's a beautiful world Ain't nothing on the screen that's ever gonna be this view Oh, it's a beautiful world And I just wanna share with you It's a beautiful world Such a beautiful world Hey friends, I am so glad you're here today because our guest is Danielle Cartes. Yes, that Danielle who just stepped into next level chef. She filmed in Ireland under massive pressure with real stakes and she is bringing the heart and the story behind that story. This episode is one part, how did this even happen? And one part, how do you rebuild when life knocks you flat? Because Danielle's story has real loss in it and real resilience. She's taken some hits in life and you'll hear what helps you keep moving forward. We're talking marriage, money, stress, motherhood, faith and what it looks like to keep showing up until the next chapter finally opens. Before we jump in, if you love conversations that make you feel more alive and more hopeful, hit follow on the show right now so new episodes will drop straight into your feed. And listen, I have 30 episodes in the hopper and they are stacked. There is so much coming to carry you all the way through February. You do not want to miss what's queued up. And one more thing, I think this episode is a share it immediately kind of episode. I'm such a huge Danielle fan. So while you're listening, if you think of someone who needs this kind of positive energy today and a reminder that it's not too late for good things to show up, then tap the share button and text it over. Okay, let's get into it. Here is my conversation with Danielle Cartes. March is when homeschool families start looking ahead. You can almost see the finish line. Spring goals, end of year milestones, maybe even testing around the corner. And this is such an important time to reinforce key skills and build confidence before wrapping up the year. If you are thinking about assessments, whether required by your state or simply the benchmarks you set for your family, it's helpful to have a tool that makes review simple and clear. That's where IXL can really shine. IXL is an award winning online learning platform that fits seamlessly into homeschooling. It offers interactive practice across mathling, which are at science and social studies from pre-K through 12th grade. It personalizes learning for each child, keeps them engaged, and gives parents clear insight into progress. What stands out this time of year is the real time feedback and progress tracking. Kids get instant explanations when they miss something and parents can see exactly where growth is happening and where a little reinforcement might help. It takes the guesswork out of finishing strong, make an impact on your child's learning, get IXL now, and when thousand hours outside listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership, we may sign up today at IXL.com slash 1000 hours. Visit IXL.com slash 1000 hours to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price. Welcome to the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. My name is Ginny Erch, I'm the founder of 1000 Hours Outside, and I'm sitting here slightly sick with also a slightly sick guest, but I'm so excited that she's here. Danielle Cardes, welcome back. Oh my gosh, thank you for having me. I was just telling you, I, it's such a thrill to be able to be on your podcast not only once, but this is my second time. It's just, it's an honor. It's such an honor. I'm so nervous. I'm always like, how, get my kids outside. How many hours? This is so good for us. Look, we're clocking it off, we're healing our brains. I want to have you on all the time. Thank you. Because, you know, we had this first conversation, if people want to go back and listen to it, but you had someone that reached out with you or someone from your book publisher, someone reached out and they were like, I got this cookbook coming out called the best kids cookbook and, you know, again, we talked about it and I have a hard, sometimes I have a hard time talking about cookbooks because I'm like, what are we going to talk about for an hour? And I said, yes, it was like the best yes I've ever said because you came on and I was like, I love this woman. So then I went on, I've got your book now, you have so many cookbooks. So I'm going to amass my collection and I know you have a new one coming out in April. People can probably pre-order that already. I have the meant to share cookbook, which I love because this is about like getting together with other people, but I also then read your memoir. I love memoirs and I love that you wrote a memoir and I took 10 pages on your memoir. It's called notes and recipes. Well, it's called you were always there. Notes and recipes for living a life you love. And also, since we talked, there is big news that on and we're going to time this so that it comes out right before you're on the Gordon Ramsay thing. Yes. Oh my gosh, next level chef season five, your girl in all her 43 years of glory does a game show competition stressful, crazy, make it to the platform. I did participate in Gordon Ramsay show. We filmed in Ireland in 2025 between September and October. It was insane. It was absolutely one of the wildest things I've ever done, but I'm really proud of myself for saying yes, because sometimes we can get a little bit scared and said in our ways like, Hey, I'm 43. I'm a woman of a certain age. I'm experiencing hot flashes, all the things. And we can say that's not for me. And I fully know that no matter how this turns out, because I can't say that God really did provide this opportunity for me. And I almost said no, I almost said like, Oh, that's not for me. But it's it was for my own preconceived notions. Like that's not for me because I'm old. That's not for me because I'm chubby. I'm not fast. I'm not going to make it to that platform with young whippersnapper kids. And the fact of the matter is that God has got a plan for us at any age. Look at Sarah and Abraham. I mean, homegirl had a baby and she was pushing 100. God just sometimes surprises us if we are open and willing. And I want to live a life that says yes to the Lord every single time. Okay, so this kicks off. I'm like crying, but it's it's mainly because I'm doused with peppermint oil. I love it. This is an incredible message. And this kicks off on January 29th on Fox. We're watching I've never watched next level shit. And our whole family is going to watch. And I'm thrilled. So the story was that, you know, the podcast, people joined in on 1000 hours outside a lot of times around the new year. So I'm always like, well, who am I going to have on on January 1st? And I was not I didn't plan well. And it was like coming down to the wire. And I was like, if there's anybody I would want for January 1st, it would be Danielle. Because you're just so peppy. And you have such like, like to kick off the year, you're a kick off the year type person. Thank you. So then I didn't plan it. And then I was like, well, someone canceled and I was like, it's so last minute, but let me ask Danielle anyway, maybe she can do it. But then I forgot there's a time change. And it was gonna be like 6am for you. And you're like, I'll do it anyway. But then kids were sick, which happens all the time. And you're like flying. I mean, you are all over the place. You're flying back and forth. You're gonna flying him from New York. I was on with Kelly Clarkson, you know, I'm doing all these things. That is what happened though. When it finally came down to it. And I hadn't planned this out. The January 1st episode was episode 666. And I was like, I don't really know what people do about that. But what we will write through it that we claim that back for Jesus. We know that. Those are that's for Jesus. We're gonna say it's 18 now. So I did it. I was like, I'll just do it. It's gonna be my own thing. But this actually works out really well because I'm so excited for people to watch next level chef, even though we're like, we're gonna bail out screens, we're gonna get outside and we're gonna watch next level chef. It's gonna be wonderful. Absolutely. This ties actually right in with your incredible memoir. Thank you. This is a memoir about falling in love with your life after you feel like your world is falling down. And I think it has such strong messages also for mothers. So one of the topics that's woven throughout this memoir, which is called You Are Always There is about losing ourselves. And you say over and over again, in spite of what I believed at the time, I have not lost myself in motherhood. You say, I've heard many women say they lost themselves. They lost themselves to a bad marriage. They lost themselves to a dead-end job. They lost themselves to motherhood. The truth is you are still you. You just took a different route. And it's okay to reevaluate and figure out what you need to do to fix things up and pivot along with the Lord's guidance. You lost your restaurant. You feel like you ruined everything. And yet it takes time. But here you are about to be on next level, Chef. You already taped it. So are you able to even tell your husband? You know what? My husband does know. He knows some things. But he's the only one. There is absolutely nobody else that knows anything else. I feel like we got the okay. Spouses are cool. But we all signed as a family. Our little, like, hey, we're not going to give anything away for the show. And so that part, I feel like super confident about. But it's so hard for me because I get excited. I'm like, I want to tell everybody all the things. But what I've been focusing on is just talking about the experience and then just letting people in on the why I said yes at this point. And then every single week, if I make it or not, there's going to be fun things to talk about during those weeks. And the neat thing about the show is it sort of has these auditions that happen for the first, second, and third week of the show. And I'm in the home, chef auditions. So my sort of show debut doesn't happen till episode three. So that's February 12, which is really, really cool. You're going to see me in the show, but you're going to watch different groups. So you're going to watch the professional chefs perform and sort of audition to see if they can make it as for a spot on the show. Because right away, nine people get eliminated. And if you're hoping to just not be one of those nine people, but the pressure is on. So it's pretty, it's pretty wild. Well, you know what? It is kind of a cool thing in life to have some surprises in your own mind. Like, you know, that other people don't know, are you going to do watch parties? You know what? I think I am going to do a watch party, but here's the old lady and me. The show doesn't come on in the Northwest until 8pm. I think on the East Coast, it might be 7pm. That's a little bit more doable. But it doesn't come on until eight o'clock at night. And I'm like, there is school the next day and I want to be anywhere, but in my jammies at 8pm. So I haven't planned a watch party yet, but so many people are reaching out saying, do a watch party or you're going to have a watch party. Just do a jammie watch party for moms. That would be super cool. Late night snacks, watch party for moms come in your pajamas so you can literally get home and roll right into bed. That's right. That's right. And it just goes to show that you don't have to lose yourself. So when we talked before, I didn't know your backstory and I started to learn it during our conversation. I just knew about this amazing cookbook you have that's called the best kids cookbook and how to make all these amazing things. So we started to talk about your story and I learned more about it in your memoir, but you had this restaurant that you opened and I did phenomenal. And I couldn't quite figure out if you ended up pronouncing it Minola or Minoella or Minola. And this is off of a citrus fruit. Okay. So everybody thinks of oranges that are bright and fun and lovely and there is a Minola tangelo. It's a mixture between a pomelo and a tangerine. It is absolutely delicious. My very favorite citrus fruit in the whole world. I always thought it was pronounced Minola. And so when it came down to it, we were naming the restaurant. I wanted to call it Minola and it wasn't and then somebody said, well, that's Minola. And I'm like, no, it's not. And then she said, we go to Google and I'm like typing it in like, please say this word. And it says Minola. And I was like, Oh, no, I have to rename this thing then. And I changed the spelling so that it was Minola because for so many years Minola was in my heart. And in the middle of Minola is Noel and that means my gift. And I really do believe that that restaurant in all of its glory with all of its flaws was just a gift from the Lord. And I can remember when we closed standing and asking the Lord like and questioning him like, God, you promised to take care of me through this place. I know that I was seeking after you. I know that I was following after you and we lost it all lock, stock and barrel home cars are wheel. My husband and I almost got divorced. But God use Noah our child. I was pregnant at the time. That's why I mean, there's so many fun things to talk about about our story. But just to kind of rewind a little bit from the very beginning, Mike and I were new newlyweds, and we decided to open this restaurant. And in the course of those three years, it got wildly successful and we grew wildly apart. And we were both so selfish that we're like, Okay, cool, let's end it. I've got my little empire, you've got your job, we have no children. Let's just do this. I remember telling my dad and he cried. And he just said, This is just not this is not what I want. This is never what I wanted for you. And there's no shame and divorce. I never want my story to make anybody feel badly if they have walked a road where they did end up in divorce that happens. And that's okay. God chose for me in my life and our walk to really help us. And there was no abuse or anything. So I'm not saying like, if you've gone through some things, you've gone through some things. But for Mike and I, we were just selfish. We just didn't like being married anymore. We were just not, we didn't want to answer to each other. And God just really worked all that selfishness out of us. And I decided that I would never cook again. When the restaurant closed and we lost our home and we filed for bankruptcy, I thought, gosh, cooking cost me everything. I'm selfish. I just want to be a mom. And I started cooking again when Noah was around six months old, we couldn't afford food. It was on, you know, government programs like Wix so you could get cheese and peanut butter and baby food and Noah wouldn't eat the baby food. And I just remember thinking, gosh, maybe I'll try to cook something. There was a celebrity at the time that had these little squeezy pouches. And they were like, roasted plums and zucchini. And they were very bougie. And they were like, I remember being like $1.99 a piece. And Noah's 14 now. So that was like very expensive back then. And it was just not in our budget. And I did remember buying one at Walmart and feeling like it was this little pouch of gold. And I was like, maybe Noah will eat this. And he slurped it up like he just couldn't get enough of it. And it was plums and zucchinis. And I thought, okay, if I buy plums and zucchinis, I can roast them like it says on the package. And I remember roasting them and blending them up and Noah just loving it. And I was like, Oh, Lord, I do love to cook. I want to cook again, because I stopped cooking. I'm like this cost cooking took everything from me. And it really didn't cooking saved my life. And it gave us a career in cooking. God used cooking for me to tell tell them about his glory and his goodness. When I mean, that's so funny to me, like God's going to use whatever he can in our lives for his glory. And I think if we're open and willing and open to share, some people like, gosh, it's so hard to hear you talk about, you know, your marriage struggling, because I my marriage is struggling. And I just it's a little it's hard for me. I can't believe you're telling people. I'm like, well, if we're open and honest, then the Lord gets in there and the enemy doesn't get in all those little cracks and secrecy. If we find people that we can be transparent with like marriage is difficult. And Mike is my best friend, we're going on 18 years of marriage and there is nobody else that I would want to do this with. But we almost called it quits 14 years ago. I mean, we were literally like, bye, this restaurant knock our socks off. I don't like you. I don't like being poor. And what a what a blessing of a baby. Oh, you know, people say the opposite, you know, especially as it's a cultural message, you know, that it's going to make things harder. And yet your story is so beautiful, because the baby brings you together. It's out here you are so many years later. Yeah. And the thing that's so cool about Noah is I know they say like, don't have a baby to save your marriage, but God used Noah to save us. And I I'm telling you, my life didn't start till Noah was born. And that's not because like my children are my whole world and they supersede everything. Like I love my kids, but I have a beautiful career. My the Lord comes first and then my relationship with my husband and then my kids. And sometimes people hear that they're a little like, Oh, but it there's so much balance in that. I love my children like you would lay my whole life down for them, do anything for them. I, you know, I'm up at night crying over them. They're our kids. It's real. But God did so much in my heart when I started having children. They're a mirror reflection of us. I mean, our kids, they're gonna, if they're snotty, snarky, talk back, whatever, it's coming from me and Mike. I mean, they have their own little lower natures that they're working out. But I mean, talk about the healing that happened in my heart when I had my son over yelling too much, screaming too much, just having the wrong priorities. And then God's saying like, I want to heal what's broken inside of you. So you could be a better mom because generational trauma and things that have been passed down for, you know, multiple generations, just because your granny did it doesn't mean it's okay. God wants to heal it and break it. And so I love to tell people that's why this book is so important to me. We do, I used to feel like I lost myself. I lost myself when that restaurant closed. I lost myself when I had a baby that needed me and feeling touched out and, you know, trying to work full time and juggle. Mike and I would drive because I was a makeup artist and we would, and he was coming from Bellevue, which is about 45 minutes north of us, we would drive and pass off a sleeping baby in a car seat so that I could get and work opposite shifts just so we could make it happen. And during those times when we didn't have anything but each other, God really showed up in my heart and showed me what was important. I mean, I, for me to go from these situations where my pantries empty, we're packing, you know, peanut butter and jelly sandwiches to the Rachel Ray show and, and trying to just share with people our books and the things that we're doing. And we self published. The thing that's really neat about me is the part that says you can't do something is broken. It's always been broken. I mean, since I was a little girl, if someone said, Hey, can you do that? Oh, you can't do that. You're not famous. You don't have any, you don't have the right connections. We have the biggest connection in the whole world as a creator of the universe. The Lord orchestrate our steps if we are willing. And, and I don't pretend that it wasn't easy, but I never stopped. Yeah, you never quit. That is actually a really, really big part of the story. And I think when people read memoirs, especially ones that are centered around someone's faith, you start to think, could I see you, you're like, could this be my story as well? It's a powerful way to step into someone's life and then to start to imagine, could God do the same for me? And this was a very long time of waiting. You weren't at that makeup counter for five months. You were at that makeup counter for five years, five years, Danielle. And I just saw that that's a big message of the book too. Not quitting has brought blessings into my life. Resting and checking in with the Lord often has brought blessings. I don't think we ever arrived. I think we're meant to keep moving toward authenticity. But I, I really took pause at the five years at the makeup counter. You call them your ugly years. And you know, you, you know, you made friends there. But you know, you're with all of these makeup artists who don't know your story and you just feel like, is this ever, and you're working these swing shifts and Mike's delivering bread. And you say, my life was a shadow of what I'd always hoped for. And it made me wonder, Danielle, like if my life felt like a shadow of what I'd always hoped for for five years, that's so long. Yeah. Yeah. What I still press forward. You know what's so funny about that? I have a real tenderness to the Holy Spirit and I have never been really fortunate. I don't want this to sound like I'm proud. I've never been angry with the Lord. I've always known that Jesus was on my side. Even when things were, you know, going completely awry, I have never been angry at God. I never shook my fist at the Lord and said, why did you do this to me? I hate you for this. I get emotional thinking about it. I know that the Lord loves me beyond the shadow of a doubt. And I know that that's a gift. Not everybody feels that way. And I know that every single day when I was in it, I didn't have designs for fame. I had designs for survival. And I remember there's one point in the book where I talk about how I ran out of pretzels because there was pretzels in my pocket and just feeling like that was the last of my food. And I was at work and I went in the bathroom and cried because I knew I wasn't coming home to food. And those vulnerable times made me press into Jesus. And I remember my mom telling me when she was early on in her marriage with my father that they were struggling with their bills. And she, I remember her saying that she held up her bills into the sky and said, you are my provider, you are my dad, please pay my bills, help me. And my parents, I mean, my mom said from that day forward, things didn't change, but the provision started to happen in a different way. And I just remember thinking that like, God, you are my provider, you are our provider. And when you run a business, it's not all hearts and flowers anymore. Like my husband and I, we are freelancers. And there's been times over these last 15 years where, you know, people have owed us thousands and thousands of dollars and the money isn't coming in. And we're, I'm right back to that provisionary God, you promised to pay our bills. I mean, a couple of years ago, our tuition bounced. And I'm like, it's Christmas time and my checks aren't coming in. And I'm like, God, what can I, what can I do? And I threw up some dinner parties and I sold 10 of them. I never sold 10 dinner parties in one, in one evening. I mean, just to think of that in the level of provision, like where God's like, Hey, I have got your back. And knowing too that if an outcome doesn't happen, how I need it to, or in my timeline, that God wasn't listening to me or didn't hear my prayer, because I'm writing a new book right now called, Don't Mind If I Burn Your House Down. And it's a really funny, it's a sequel to this guy. And it really is like, it talks funny stories where I did a catering job and I almost did burn this ladies' house down. But the flip side of that is the double meaning. The double meaning is that I'm, I'm in here to burn your house down. I want to burn down all those preconceived notions that we have about life and re, and replace it with the truth, with gospel truth. Like God doesn't promise our lives to be easy. And I'm grateful that me working for NBC and on the Kelly Clarkson show and doing these high profile cool things. I'm so grateful that it gives me a platform to share the realness of Jesus and the Holy Spirit and his designs for our life. It's not perfect. I still fight with my husband. We still don't see eye to eye on certain things. But at the end of the day, we love each other so much. And that is what's more valuable. March is when homeschool families start looking ahead. You can almost see the finish line. Spring goals, end of year milestones, maybe even testing around the corner. And this is such an important time to reinforce key skills and build confidence before wrapping up the year. If you are thinking about assessments, whether required by your state or simply the benchmarks you've set for your family, it's helpful to have a tool that makes review simple and clear. That's where IXL can really shine. IXL is an award winning online learning platform that fits seamlessly into homeschooling. It offers interactive practice across math language art, science, and social studies from pre-K through 12th grade. It personalizes learning for each child, keeps them engaged, and gives parents clear insight into progress. What stands out this time of year is the real time feedback and progress tracking. Kids get instant explanations when they miss something and parents can see exactly where growth is happening and where a little reinforcement might help. It takes the guesswork out of finishing strong, make an impact on your child's learning, get IXL now, and when thousand hours outside listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership. We may sign up today at IXL.com slash 1000 hours. Visit IXL.com slash 1000 hours to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price. Every season I find myself wanting our home to breathe a little easier. Not a full renovation, just thoughtful updates that make the space work better for our real everyday life. That's why I love shopping at Wayfair. Our style leans warm and collected, a little modern, a little lived in. 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But if we put that aside because some things aren't changing and start to have more fun together, I think that's the secret sauce. I was thinking about that this morning. I want to be transparent in my marriage. I want to be transparent in my motherhood journey. I want to be transparent in my business journey. It's not all easy all the time but sometimes we land some really great contracts and some months are lean and it keeps me dependent on Jesus in a way that I'm grateful for. And I know now at the time I didn't, I never lost who I was. I kept thinking if I could just get back to the girl that I was before I was on government assistance, if I could just get back to the woman that I was before my marriage was hard, if I could just get back to that, if my body could come back and my apron belly would go away, now I have children. My husband said something to me about 10 years ago. He said, I'm like, does this bother you? It's like what's the wobbly stomach that just drops? And he's like, absolutely not. You made our kids. I don't care what your body looks like that you made our children. You don't have to, I'm like, maybe you should try to get this cut off. He's like, why? When you see that, you gotta think about how you made our kids. And I think about that now. Like, I will take every wrinkle, every battle wound, every scar to be the woman that I am today. And I want that for other women. I want that for other people. I don't, I don't think we're supposed to go through life like wishing and hoping that it would have shoulda coulda. When I say my life was a shadow of what I always hoped it would be. I think that I really, I came to life in that shadow. There is nothing, no experience that I would change no matter how hard, and no humbling that I wouldn't change. There is some things that happen. There's an anointing that happens in the pressing, and I want that anointing. I want that relationship with Jesus. And so I want that for other people. I want them to laugh and cry and know that they are exes, especially in Christ Jesus. You can't lose who you are. And now if you're walking against the Lord and doing some other things, I mean, maybe you could lose a little bit of who you are. But just to be real, but there is so much to be mined out of the hard stuff. That's where, that's where the good stuff happens. It really is. Yeah. People will love the memoir. Yeah. It is a phenomenal memoir. I just want to talk about this one line because you talked about the pretzel story. There's so many good stories in here. But the pretzel story about how you take this one bag of pretzels, you go to the makeup counter, your pretzels are gone. This is the end of your food. And you have this line, it's actually in the intro, where you talk about finding wonderful things in the pockets we thought were empty. And this is a story that God shows up. And you know, truly in the Bible, if you look at all of these stories, these powerful stories are these ones where God shows up in the very nick of time. That's kind of like the way he does it. It's like Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed to go. They're in the fire. The fire that kills the guards or whatever, that even when they come close, it's that hot. And you know, it wasn't like they got saved before they got thrown in. They got saved when they got thrown in or Daniel and the lion's den. Or you know, when Jesus comes to heal these sick people, you know, it comes in the nick of time and then you know it's God. You give him all the glory. You have to depend. Yeah. And you see this time and again in your story. So I just want to highlight a couple of the stories that are in here. Just a few, like I said, I have 10 pieces of notes of your memory. And I'm so excited that you're writing another one. So when you're talking about your struggling in your marriage, and then all of a sudden, all of a sudden, actually at your restaurant, you start putting too much garlic and everything. And everyone's like, Danielle, this is disgusting. Earning. I wanted, I was at one point, I was chewing garlic cloves, just chewing them. And I thought this is, I can't get enough garlic. And then I was like, oh, you can't even taste the garlic in the bruschetta. You can't even taste the garlic in the spinach chip. And, and dishes were getting sent back. They were like, uh, this is way, this is so garlic. It's like, you know how you get too much garlic, it's that burn on the tip of your tongue. And then it just, it's like this sort of bitter, acrid way too strong. That's what I couldn't get enough of. And one of the gals was like, you're, you're pregnant. And I was like, there is no, trust me, there's no way. It's not super happy at home. But then I was like, is there, there is a possibility. There we go. And you know, I love this thread of, this has been a topic of conversation throughout the year here that God uses our sensory experiences as memory, like memory triggers. So like, you know, it's like, what's it be, you kind of like, oh, what do people do before there was cell phones and you could take a picture of everything? It's like, no, you have these, and you talk about this all through the book, you know, different types of smells and terracotta strawberry planter that reminds you of your auntie Charlotte and things that remind you of your grandmother, you know, she's making this glorious fudge. And then the garlic, and this is reminding you of this time that you find out that you're pregnant. So you're struggling in your marriage, you're nearly divorcing. And there's a story about pillows. Yes, this was really special. This is when I knew we were going to make it. So we had moved away, we're in a little apartment, we lost our house, we're through it. And we're still not happy, but we're making it, we're going through some things. And Mike would wake up at, you know, anywhere from one to three o'clock in the morning to go to work. And Noah's a toddler at the time, I don't even think he's two years old. And he not, I'm a big water gal, always always have water with me. So I've got my water on my nightstand. And Noah knocks a giant jug. I mean, this is like 30 ounces of water over onto my pillows. And we didn't have extra pillows. And I remember like cleaning it up and there's water sopping everywhere. So we kind of clean it in this, you know, nighttime stupor. Mike says here, I have an extra, I have an extra pillow. And I was like, Oh, you're not thinking of it because you know that in between time, you're toddler, you're waking up, everything, it's wild. I didn't think too much of what was going on. I just took Mike's pillow and I fell asleep. And the next morning when I woke up, I looked at Mike's side of the bed for some reason, and there was no pillow, but I had one. And I remember thinking like, he didn't have to tell me he had an extra, but he knew that if he said, Oh, you can have mine, I would have refused it. No, I wouldn't do that. I'll just go without. I think women a lot of times we go without, we would just be like, Oh, I'll be the one to go without. And when Mike did that, it showed me that we weren't too far gone. And that did something for me in my heart to know that like God was working on him and he was working on me and we were going to make it. And I love that Mike slept with no pillow that night, but I sat on the end of the bed and just cried at the possibility that we were going to be okay. I want to read what you wrote. This small, seemingly insignificant gesture meant more to me than flowers or a night out. He had sacrificed his own comfort for me and I knew we were healing. I made his favorite spaghetti for dinner that night. I made pasta and added olives and peppers. Mike loves spaghetti. I mean, he really loves it. These small things helped us to appreciate each other to knock down our walls. I stopped taking everything so seriously. We start laughing again. We are both weird and funny. And I love that about us. And at this point, he wrote today, we've been married for 14 years and he is my bright spot. So just, I mean, the book has got wonderful stories. Wonderful stories. Oh, it's so good. And you talk about how like you didn't do super well in high school. No, I barely graduated high school. I barely, I struggled with reading. I mean, I've never been tested for anything. I'm sure there's some little dyslexic things in there. I struggled to write. I didn't understand concepts. I read sometimes I'll naturally read a sentence from, you know, right to left instead of left to right. And these are things that I work through and struggle with still to this day. And to think that, you know, I bear, I flunked out at basically everything. There was a teacher, Mrs. Fitzroy, if she didn't change my failing history grade to a C, I wouldn't have graduated high school. I had barely a 2.0 GPO GPA, whatever you call it. And I remember going to Helen Fitzroy and saying, I'm not going to graduate, Ms. Fitzroy. And she said, well, we can, we can work some things around it. And it wasn't that work wasn't turned in. It was that I struggled so hard. And I mean, I went to high school 25 years ago. It was before learning disabilities and figuring out how to work around kids and what they need. And and I tried, but I just, I couldn't cut it at that time. And then marrying Mike, who's like this literature buff, and he's incredible. And I call him my own personal Gordon Lisch. He's just an editor of all my things. He slowly started to teach me in a way how to write and I write stream of consciousness. I just get everything all out. There's no grammar, no punctuation, everything's misspelled. And then for myself, I'll go through and I start fixing the words that are misspelled. And my phone really helps me. I write every single book with in the notes on my phone, which is wild. People think I'm crazy. But it's a way that I can like say, Oh, how does naturally feel like there's a sentence break. So I still don't even know the principles of writing a sentence. And I write books for a living. So I want people to know that it doesn't matter if you were the smartest, it doesn't matter. I mean, the point too, when I go to publish my books, where I had I worked with a gal, she was a paralegal, and she's like, Oh, I'll edit your cookbook. And I'm like, this is wonderful. So I give her my little thumb drive with my cookbook on it. And she meets me in a parking lot two days later and says, you're really good makeup artist. I don't know that you should be a writer. And I felt so dumb. I just felt like, gosh, Lord, what am I thinking? I'm not a writer. I bear I can I can barely three sentence together. And I remember another friend of mine saying, I know a gal that works at the college, maybe she'll look at your stuff. And I felt the Lord saying like, you better go and do this. So I had Noah, he was a baby. And I go to have coffee with her turns out that she is the dean of the English department at this particular college. And I was so intimidated. And I, I looked during the eye and I held up my thumb drive and I said, against my better judgment, I'm here, but I'm not smart. I, I think I told her I could cry. I think I told her I was stupid. And she said, Oh, no, no, no, that's not for me to decide. Like, you don't even worry about that. Finish your coffee. I'll just take a look at it. And I remember her calling me a couple weeks later saying, you are not stupid. The way that you write is brilliant. And you just need a little help with the mechanics. And that's what we're here for. You get all that brilliance out on, on paper, you get it into your computer and I will fix it. And she gave me the permission to know, I mean, this woman who was like the dean of English, like in this department at this beautiful prestigious school tells me, you are not stupid, you're brilliant. And so I think that kids that learn a different way. Sometimes it's just so important to find that brilliant thing. Like my son now, he learns everything phonetically. So he spells out, you know, he spells Thanksgiving because he had a little list. He spelled it fixed giving. We kept it because it looks like the F word. But it's just how we spelled it. I think it's so brilliant because he can write the coolest story with so much emotion and so much detail. Every single word is spelled wrong, but he's a brilliant writer. And so I want to foster that in him just because he doesn't do it the way that we think he should or that the world says he should. Doesn't mean that God didn't deposit the coolest story writing element into his life and into his heart. So, right. That's right. It's right. You know, I interviewed this man named John Muir-Laz. It was one of my first interviews and he was a nature journalist and a very famous one. You know, he like draws pictures and he's, he does all these conferences. He's really influential in what he does and he has dyslexia. He knew as a child that he had dyslexia though. And so he, I mean, he really did struggle at school and now he has such a message for all the parents. He's like, these kids have superpowers. They approach life a very different way. That is incredible gift. And he said, there's all sorts of people that can spell check my work. There's all sorts of people that can come in and find where the comma goes. He's like, I don't have to be able to do that. And the people who like to do that really like to do that. Mike's like, maybe get into a discussion anytime about a, I don't know, a college comma and where the placement. And he was like, you know, he was like all off and arms and they got rid of the double spaces after the period. And now, I mean, there's so many funny things that these people that love English and love the mechanics of it, they were born that way. That's just, I know I was born with no filter and I can cook and cooking makes sense to me. And so God was able to use the thing that makes the most sense that I have the most peace. I can troubleshoot. I'm not afraid of a steak burning. Like these little things are the reason that this one of my superpowers. Yes. And so me cooking has opened the door because I never, I couldn't get into college. Do you know that I applied to four universities when I was in high school and I got declined by every single one of them. I had to take the SATs again because they thought that something was malfunctioned on it. I got right around the same score. There was no malfunction. I could just barely figure. I just, it just, I just couldn't figure it out. And God's been so gracious because my education has been lifelong. Right. And I think that after I stopped thinking I needed to be a certain way, I was actually able to learn better and different. Yeah. And isn't it a gift that our holes, they provide some sort of glory for someone else? Yeah. My mom, she couldn't bought a typo from a mile away. She got a typo recently in like a crossword puzzle book. And so she emailed the company, sent them a letter and they sent her a shirt, a free shirt, something about crossword puzzles. She wears it everywhere. Just around of it. So you're like, that's what it is. It's like we come together and it's really such an important message for anyone listening who has these deep seated feelings of unworthiness. Yes. And for any child who's listening who feels like they're not measuring up to the standard of a school system. You can learn, you can learn in so many different ways and there are so many things for you. Yeah. Okay. I have been waiting to say this. Wombikes is the official 2026 bike partner of 1000 hours outside. And it just makes sense because here's what I know when kids fall in love with riding bikes, something shifts. They go from hesitant to flying down the sidewalk with total confidence. And that confidence spills into everything else. These bikes are lightweight, thoughtfully designed and built so kids can actually succeed. The brakes fit their hands. The geometry fits their bodies. They feel capable right away. And in a world pulling our kids towards screens, bikes pull them toward freedom. 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That's W-A-Y-F-A-I-R.com. Wayfair. Every style, every home. And your journey, you know, it's like you're serving people through food and at Manola, people are coming in and having their, you know, they're getting engaged. They're having their parties. They're having these incredible moments because you step out and you create this restaurant and you're serving people through food. Yeah. And you have another incredible story in this book. The book is called You Are Always There. It is a phenomenal memoir. It will fill you with all the fill. It will fill you, it will fill you, it will fill you with all the fill. It'll fill you right up, girl. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you right up, girl. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you up. It'll fill you up. All right. Serving people through food. Can you talk about your neighbor, Tom? Okay. This is actually really special. So we were shooting the book, my first cookbook. And I had seen this neighbor multiple times and I was like, oh gosh, I haven't seen you in a while. And he rolled up one day and we were shooting short ribs on the outside of our porch. And I, this is so crazy. He was like, gosh, that smells good. But he was just a shadow of himself, just skin and bones. And his wife or girlfriend at the time, I actually can't remember. I think maybe in the book I call her her wife and I think I make up her name because I didn't her name. So I make up, but I knew his name was Tom. And they send up and he kind of looks at the carrots and the pot roast and the short ribs and says like, wow, that smells incredible. And I was like, oh yeah, you know what it sure does. And we finish up and normally after we finish up our little photo shoots, because we wanted the natural light and my buddy Jeff was over and we're doing this little shoot for our self published cookbook. I thought maybe I'll just go get, he said, he thought it smelled so good. Maybe I'll just go give Tom and his wife there this dinner. And I remember walking it up in the bowl just right as we shot it. And I knocked on the door is my upstairs to adjacent apartment. And she opened the door and there was family inside. And I knew the gravity of the moment when I was there, he was on the couch with a blanket and they didn't say anything. And she said, Oh, this is so gracious. Thank you. And I just remember not thinking much of it, but leaving. And a couple of weeks later, I was in my closet talking to my mom and I was crying just like, our life was hard. We had no money. I was, you know, Eek and everything out for these shoots. And and I just, I didn't have any certainty. And there was a knock at my door and I went to the door and it was her and she was holding the, the white dish against her chest. And instantly I knew that Tom was no longer with us. And she said that he enjoyed that meal. It was the last thing that he ever ate. And I was thinking about like, sometimes if we feel so empty and so broken that we can't give to other people, if we can't put ourselves out there still in the midst of it, you don't have to be healed to make a difference. You don't have to have all the money in the world to share what you have. Knowing that the food that I created was the last thing that he ate to hopefully he went to heaven was really impactful for me. I think it solidified in my heart and we held each other and cried on my front porch. I never talked to her again. I never saw her again. We have these moments where we can be impactful for the Lord and other people's lives. It's so important to not ignore those feelings. If you have a feeling like, pay for their gas. Oh gosh, Lord, I don't, I don't have enough gas. Pay for their gas. Buy someone groceries. Drop dinner off. Do something. Tell somebody you see at the grocery store, I love your blouse. You have no idea. Maybe that was somebody's, their mother's blouse and they're missing them. Maybe that person hasn't had human connection in a minute. There, it's so important to not ignore these feelings. That's the leading of the Holy Spirit. And when you can get keen to those little feelings and you work, that's how God works. God, wear his hands and feet. So if I didn't, if I, you know, poo pooed that off, like, go give him your dinner. I was like, gosh, it was on her front porch. We're just like standing over it. This is so weird. Everything in me, if I was shy, I would have been like, ew, would I like it if someone showed up my doorstep with open short ribs? Open, open, not covered. Would I do it? Would I like it? So I mean, these things just push it all out of your mind because her standing on my front porch, that was healing for her. Who knows if she'll ever remember it, but it was special and significant. And feeding, both, is so important. Feeding, for me, feeding you is to love you in a real, tangible way like this. I love you and made this for you. Yeah. And when you eat short ribs, you remember, you remember, this says, Tom had passed away, she said. She went on to tell me that the food I gave him was his last meal. A meal, he'd said, was some of the best food he'd ever tasted. I cried. I'm telling you, you could grab this trifecta of books. You were always there as a memoir, the best kids cookbook you do right alongside with your kids. It's phenomenal and meant to share. And there's so many other cookbooks too. But you know, like a little gift for yourself. And this will be life changing for you. They will really touch your heart. Let's do a little lighter one. Talk about eating Lydia's sausages. Oh my gosh. You guys, I'm such a freak. I had this. I just roommate. Lovely. Beautiful. She was a nurse. Just the sweetest, nicest little gal. And she was cooking Midwestern casseroles. Now, listen, I'm from the Pacific Northwest. I didn't know much about Midwestern casseroles growing up. We had pizza, taco, spaghetti, hamburger soup. Those are like our basics. My mom would sort of venture out of the box every once in a while and she'd make like a creamy lasagna or a chicken de van. But we had these, you know, 10 meals. They were on the rotation all the time. Potato, salad, barbecue chicken. Lydia made things like pork meatballs with grape jelly and ketchup. And I'm not joking. I was such a little junk food hound. I was like, this is amazing. Everything about everything she made was so good. So she made this casserole and I'm not joking. I was the chokehold that this Kilbasa and potato and creamy hand soup casserole had on me. I had just worked like all day. I was, I came home. I was starving. Lydia made the casserole and I was like, Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I don't have any food. I'm such a freak. Maybe I'll just open her lunch and take one piece of salt, one piece of Kilbasa out like a monster. And I opened it up and I was like, Okay, that was good. You can't even tell. I kind of used a fork to like smooth it all around. Put the lid back on. And then it was almost as if the casserole was calling me. And then I was like, just one more piece of sausage. I got through every piece of sausage over like a half hour period, like a drug addict. And I was like, Oh my God, what am I going to do? What am I going to do? What am I going to do? And so I just thought, make sure there's no more sausage in it. And maybe, maybe she'll think maybe she got the last of it and there was no Kilbasa. The next day, that's me fairly early and says, did you eat the sausage out of my lunch? And like a weirdo, I said, no, maybe Michaela did. Michaela, our roommate that was hadn't been there in a month. And Lydia went on to be so gracious to me. If I remember correctly, I feel like she made another one. She never ever said another word about it. She was kind, beautiful, smart, and we both knew I was lying. And that like really convicted me. I feel like it was like this, the, you know, the elephant in the room for the rest of the time that she lived with me. But she taught through that situation taught me number one to be honest, to come clean. And that there is great, even, I don't know that I would have any grace for a freak that got into my lunch and then lied about it. And then the fact that I'm saying it out loud, telling people now 15 years, 20, 16 or 18, no, this was like 23 years ago, because we, I wasn't married. She was my roommate. Oh my gosh, this is crazy. This is crazy. But yeah, that story is, that's one for the history books. Okay. Great one. I'm not all just crying in Jesus. We're crying in Jesus blood for a freak. Okay. The power, the power of a good casserole. How about this story? You talk a lot in the book about self doubt. Yeah. And I think a lot of people's I struggle with self doubt. I struggle with, like, am I on the right path? Am I doing the right thing? Should we made that decision? Should we have moved? Or are we supposed to do this? I mean, this is like, you know, should we have had this many kids? I mean, I am struggling. Should we be entrepreneurs? Like on the daily? And so you talk about self doubt. And so the story is you walk away from food. Yeah. Because you know, you, you say, like you said, you lost everything. Even your two year old, there's a story in here where your two year old is like, they take dark car, mama, you know, like, you're losing it all. And so you're like, I'm walking away. I'm clearly not supposed to do that. And then it starts to come back. Actually, my favorite line in the entire memoir, which is called, you were always there, is Noah softened my heart toward myself. And he loved my cooking. Yeah. Oh, the power of like an eight month old. Yeah. You know, to like put that, you know, that joy. So you've got this self doubt. Barely graduate high school. You know, you're putting out these different manuscripts and some people are supportive and some people are not. And one of the times when you really doubt yourself is when you're making these dinners, and you're, you know, you're taking these photo shoots and your husband's doing some photo shoots and you're hiring people to do photo shoots, you're trying to get something out there and you get all these flies all over your dinner. That's a story. Tell us that. Oh, gosh, this is the craziest story. So, and I had so much doubt at the time, like, gosh, Lord, we can't even afford this. So I was trying to work my daily, my weekly groceries into photo shoots, like, okay, if I buy this this week, then we could eat this chicken for a couple of days. And I remember Jeff coming over and it was summertime and I felt so insecure. I was like, my hair didn't look right. We're supposed to take pictures of me for the book. And, and we literally moved my dining room table, my dining room table, a little round wooden table outside of my apartment complex to like the green belties, not even a green belt, just behind the mailboxes. And it was like this greenery area where everybody brought their dogs to poop. So we put the table in the bushes. And I'm like, okay, I have a baked chicken. I have this Greek and lemon baked chicken. And I remember opening up its high summer, it's like 100 degrees out. And it's around five o'clock in the afternoon. And I open it up and I set the table and, and Jeff's taking these pictures. And I noticed the flies. I noticed them. And I'm like, wait a minute, the flies are landing. That's, and all I could think about was that the flies are landing on our dinner, the flies are landing on our dinner. And Jeff was like, I was started panicking. And I'm like, Oh, the flies, the flies. And I was trying to shoo away. And Jeff was like, who cares, just toss it out when we're done. Well, my photographer had no idea what we were going through. He had no idea that I'm scraped. And I'm having to pay him $125, which is all the money in the world to me for each of these shoots. It's so cheap now thinking about it, you know, 16 years later. But the thing that's so crazy is he's like, don't even worry about it. Who cares? It's just a fly. Like, we'll just toss it and go get go get some Taco Bell. Like, like, some people just think that like, Oh, throw the chicken away. What was it? Eight bucks? Like six bucks? And all I could think about is I had so many plans for that chicken. I needed that chicken to be our dinner tonight. I needed the bones to be stock. And I needed to pick it off to be sandwiches for tomorrow. I had a whole plan. There was there was six meals that were coming out of this chicken that now flies on. And I remember Jeff leaving and me just feeling awful. And I called my mom and I was crying. I was like, who's our chicken? It was our dinner. And she said, you go take that chicken. And you crank the heat up to 450 degrees. And you get it in the oven and you kill anything off and you enjoy your dinner. And I was like, Oh, oh, yeah, the heat does kill any germ. And I remember cranking that chicken up thinking like, this is what we have to do in our lives. You get that chicken in there, crank up the heat and keep living. We can't stop. We can't I was literally ready to roll over and call it quits over that chicken and just seeing the flies. And I'm thinking, am I even doing the right thing? I have my dining room table out here. It's 100 degrees. We have no money and I'm taking pictures of our dinner. Like, and this was before Instagram. This is before like, there's anything that I thought I could show anybody. I just had this weird drive inside me. I'm like, I know we have to make this book. I know beyond the shadow of a doubt that we're supposed to make this book. And I didn't have a home for it. That book eventually got into Costco. That's what changed the trajectory of everything. My little self published work gets its way into Costco. And it changed our lives. And that led to, you know, work on television and all kinds of crazy things. And we still ate that chicken. All my plans for it, it wasn't perfect. I was embarrassed to tell people this story for a while. And now I'm like, I love it. Hey, if something falls on the floor, brush it off and eat it. It wasn't a different place in my life. Now I'm like, oh, it's fine, crank up the heat. I mean, now I but I wasn't there at that. Well, especially because that because the photographer is like, well, yeah, of course, you're not eating it. You know, you're just gonna throw it out, right? Yeah, you wrote this. Sometimes we just need to put one foot in front of the other where our dreams are concerned. And then you're talking about like, people are going to come alongside. There's going to be the people that can edit your book. There's going to be the person that you meet at the makeup counter. We talked about this last time. That is the Costco buyer. And you're like, God shows up at the right moment. And then there is a story of triumph and miracle. And we can give all honor and glory to God. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, these stories are just tremendous. I would like to hit one more before we wrap up. Thank you. I love you. There is a story about getting stuck in the ice. And this is like, you know, you're kind of embarrassed and you don't want to tell your dad and you're like trying to get the car out from the ice. And it's a beautiful story. Can you tell us that one? Yeah, this is so good. Okay, so this story is called Boiling Ice. And, you know, I'm an M and 80s and a 90s kid. And it's just very different. Like my kids have way more open dialogue with me than I ever did with my parents. And so I just always wanted to like, make sure that they weren't mad at me or please them or make sure that I was doing things okay. And, and as a grown woman, we're at my sister's house and it's snowy and we, we drive over there and I kind of park along the side. My sister and my mom just to give a little context, they live across the street from each other. So my parents are down a little lower, my sister's up on a hill and there's a road that goes in between. So we park right by my parents' mailbox and we're by their nice, wrought iron fence. And the kids are playing and sliding. And then I noticed that my car is, our car is stuck. And we can't back up, we can't go forward. But what we are doing is just sliding closer and closer into my parents' fence. And I was panicked. I don't know why this took such a hold of me, but I was like, my mom is going to be mad at me like I was 13 years old and I stuck out of the house. And I'm like, my mom's going to be mad. We're going to have to pay for their fence. I was just so worked up. So I'm walking up the hill, getting, we're boiling water at my sister's house, literally like we're teenagers. I'm a grown, married woman at this point, literally like we're teenagers. And I'm, we're walking the boiling water down, we're trying to get it underneath the tires. And then what it's doing is creating more of a sheet of ice. So the boiling water hits and then the ice and then we're trying to do it over and over again. Finally, I have to, I have to tell my mom where I'm sorry, my car is going to go into your fence. I'm, I don't know how it happened, but it happened. And here we are. And I remember my parents being so like, first of all, I was soaked and crying. And they were both confused. Like, okay, well, why didn't you just tell your dad? And I'm like, because my husband couldn't fix it, and Jenny's husband couldn't fix it. And there's no way you guys can fix it. We're going to ruin your fence. Yeah, you're all worked up. We're going to break your fence. My mom, my dad's like, Oh, hang on. He goes out to the garage with a couple pieces of carpet. He just puts them underneath the car and tells Mike to drive forward. And Mike just drives forward over the carpet. And I remember I can vividly see my mom standing in her doorway saying, I, you should have just told us, like, don't cry. I'm a freak just standing there in front of her. And it was so simple when I reached out for help. But when I was doing it on my own, I was cold and crying. And my husband, we're literally passing pots of boiling water back up and down this giant drive down to go under my tires to make a real sheet of ice. And all I had to do was tell my dad, Hey, I did this. And he literally had carpet scraps just in the garage, because that's what men in their 60s have. I got a couple of carpet squares. And you knew what to do. You knew exactly what to do. And my husband and my brother a lot, they didn't know what to do. They, if even my sister had a piece of cardboard, my dad was like, Yeah, if you ever get stuck, you should have some in the back of your car at all times. Now you know, now you know, it's a good life lesson. But you say, I had no idea we could get out so easily, which had so many deep meanings to it. And you talk about being an asker in the book. You say, I want you to ask, ask for the job, shoot your shot, ask to come along, ask a new friend to get coffee, get up the courage to stick out to show up to be there in spite of your tight coat. That's a story about meeting Martha Stewart. So we got to pick up the book. That is a fantastic story about the time. So good, you guys, the Martha Stewart one is brilliant. And that's about asking to be at the table. If I didn't ask, you wouldn't have that story. I wouldn't have a picture with Martha Stewart. Martha Stewart never would have snuggled into my little nape of my neck and asked if we got the photo. So seriously, get the book. I'm sure this is like a dollar on Amazon. That's the coolest part about. I know they're all my publishers are like, don't just say Amazon. But I'm like, let's be real. It is probably it's been everywhere from $3 to 15 bucks. So you're going to get this easy read for very cheap and give it to you by one for you and one for your girlfriend. Yes, absolutely. And read it together. You say go anyway, there is more value in just living than impressing the right people. Last story. Last story of a message of you don't have to try so hard. Can you talk about getting the caramel out of the pan? Oh my gosh, this is so great. So I had made I had copper pots that were sent to me from a client and they were free. And I'm like, I had never owned a copper pot in my life. And these Moviel pots are two to $300 each. So it's beautiful little sauce pot. And I burned the caramel into the base of the pot. And I ruined it. And I scrubbed it for hours. And I would pour it out and scrub again and just cry because I ruined the pot. And I remember feeling like this is kind of like my life right now. Like I'm scrubbing and trying and trying to make everything work out. And it just wasn't and I kind of decided like, I guess this pot is garbage, like I guess you're gonna have to throw the pot away. And I think you're gonna have to remind me because I don't I feel I feel like it was one of two things I either needed to use the pot for something and I just decided to boil water in it. Or somebody told me that I needed to boil water. I'm like, remind me about my own book. Yeah, okay, you say, well, I know this how it always is. People are like, I wrote that book a long time ago. You're putting me on the spot here. You say a few days went by. And you're like thinking I'm going to throw it out. I scraped and scratched with knives to chip away the thick blood crust over the bottom. I soaked and I boiled it and finally decided to give up. I drained the pan and went to set it in the garbage, but I just couldn't do it. So I left it on the counter. A few days went by I'm cleaning the kitchen. I'm loading the dishwasher. And I looked at the pot. And the gunk was crackling. I swear if I looked hard, I could see the bottom of the pan. I picked it up and touched the burn. It flaked away as if it were tissue paper. Yes. Oh my gosh, it's so funny. I had forgotten about that. That's true because I boiled and boiled and scrubbed and put everything in it. And then it did it just flaked away easily when I let it go and let it be. That story is ministering to my heart right now too. Because there's so much even now. I mean, our whole life and my whole job is like putting myself out there and talking about my books and being on shows and putting myself in front of people all the time. And sometimes I feel like, gosh, Lord, do you hear me? Sometimes I feel like that. And even thinking about that story now, sometimes you do have to just leave it alone. You just leave stuff alone and God is so capable and it did flake off. Oh my gosh, I love that. I love it. I love it. Don't have to try so hard. Yes. You have this sentence, God can cause you to have wonderful ideas and he can favor you and cause the right opportunities to come along. Opportunities that have nothing to do with your performance. To cry out to Jesus' medicine for a weary and broken soul. I believe he can work all our tragedy for his glory to be shown in our lives. You have this phrase in here, planting for harvest I knew nothing about. Even still, you know, when you wrote this memoir, you didn't know you're going to be a next level chef. No, I didn't know. And that's the thing, like planting for a harvest, you know nothing about. That's what having faith is. That's what following the Lord is like. And it's not going to be perfect and it's not going to be easy. And I had no idea that five years ago when I was writing this or six years ago, that the Lord was going to do what he's doing with it. I didn't know that I was going to be on your podcast. I've been a fan of yours for years. I think that you what you're doing is so cool and so exciting. And to think that I reached out, I literally, I think my publisher wrote you and then I was like, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to write here on Instagram. Yep. And then when you wrote me back, I'm like this woman with a million followers is going to write back to little lowly old me with 60 at the time. And just because I believed I'm like, I have a little message. I'd love to tell you about my cookbook. That was just blown away. We get on this call and I was like, wow, this woman. Why? And I just, I think about you all the time I've thought about you ever since I was like, my dream guest for kicking off the year would be Danielle of all the 600 people that I've talked to. Close to 700 people is you and, you know, from this cookbook and this isn't even your first one. It's your kid's one. So it's been such a blessing. And I think that's what people are going to get from your memoir. You are always there notes and recipes and there are recipes for living the life you love. You have this prayer, which I think is a really good prayer. God close every door. We aren't meant to open. Please open doors. No man can shut and protect my marriage and family as you're planting for a harvest that you know nothing about. I want to read this one last paragraph. I mean, we scratched the surface. This book, you know, this book did a lot for me, a lot for my soul. I'm so glad I met you and I'm so glad that I read it. You write this simply being the mom you are right now. You are shaping your children into great humans. The difficult choices you make now are setting an example for your kids. That will mean far more than anything you can tell them. You are doing a great job. You are doing the best you can with what you have. And if you aren't, then change it. Amen. Oh, Danielle, what an honor. I cannot wait to watch next level, chef. Oh my okay. I debuts January 29th. You will be on February 12th. You have a new cookbook coming out in April. Yes. And you have a ton of books and they are all, all, all phenomenal. I highly recommend every single one. Thank you. Thank you for saying yes. Thank you for reaching out and thank you for this incredible, it's a legacy that you're sharing publicly that you're allowing people to, to see themselves in your story and to wonder if would God show up for me too? Yeah. That's what I want for people. When they read this or they hear my story, I never want them to look to me and be like, wow, I wish I was like her. I want them to know that God can do the same things for them in their careers and their marriages with their mother, their journey. God can restore every feeling of inadequacy. God can just restore it and rebuild it. We, we serve a mighty God of restoration and we forget that. And read this with your girlfriends. There's also some questions in the back like study questions. If you're going to have a little book club, there's questions in the back that you can ask each other, which is actually really kind of fun. Oh, there is. There's a reading group guide right in the back. Yeah. This is the one. Go get it right now and do it with your friends. Danielle, thanks for being here and I cannot wait to watch the next level chef. Thank you, Jenny. Okay. If you love Danielle as much as I did, here's what I want you to do. Well, the emotion is still fresh. First, share this episode, tap share and send it off to a few people. This episode is a reminder that you can lose a lot and still find your way back. Second, make sure you're following the show. If 30 episodes ready to roll in February, it's going to be full of incredible conversations, practical, hopeful, and exactly the kind of company you want in your years when life is a lot. Third, if you've never left a review, would you do it today? It takes just a minute or two and it genuinely matters. Go to the show page, scroll down, tap five stars and write something. It could be anything. This review came in a few days ago from Samwise, one of the most intelligent, well researched, charming podcasters. Her guests are exceptional as is her interviewing. She is an absolute delight and such an encouragement to me as a mom, lover of wonder and low tech living. Thank you. Thank you for equipping me with every episode. I read every of you and they make my heart sing and they help other families find the show. I'm really glad you are here with me today. Let me know if you watch Danielle on Next Level Chef. I've never seen it before, so I hope it doesn't have cursing and that it is somewhat family friendly since I'm encouraging you to watch it. Until next time, may you find extraordinary moments on Ordinary Paths. Open your eyes, feel that sunshine kissing your skin, throw your worries out to the wind. Climb some trees, skin your knees, feel that grass on your feet again, get out there and take it in.