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Okay, so I was thinking about you the other day. I'm going to call you up for a problem you have. You sometimes struggle to start things for which there is not like a contract or a commitment that you would get in trouble if you didn't meet. Why do you think that is? I always feel like it's like opportunity cost because as we're all very busy, I'm thinking through my every day there's so many hours in the day. I think today I have 12 hours optimistically that I can do whatever I want. A lot of those are going to be eaten up with small tasks. So the bigger tasks, whether they're I have to at Saragordo, I have to manage a commercial hotel build on playing general contractor. I am the cameraman and everything else for videos. We have Daily stoic, which has 10 employees that need things every single day. I think it's way more than 10, but yeah. Yeah, so we have Daily stoic that has many employees that need things every day for me. And so it's kind of like a balancing act where I have a lot of things that I would like to do. For instance, right now, I'm thinking about working on a book. A book is a thing that is important to me, but when I know that I would be working on it in sacrifice or something that has a more urgent commitment to it, then things get reshuffled. And I guess I get it at some level because sometimes people ask me why do you not self-publish? And I do feel like the open-ended nature of no one is asking for it, no one necessarily wants it. I get to make all the decisions, which means I can always make an excuse. I do find that open endedness to be less than ideal. So there's something to me about like, I've sold a couple books in a row. So it's like, I always know what I'm supposed to be doing. But what does for you, what does having a piece of paper change? Because actually, I remember when you worked on your last book, you ended up pushing it like a bunch of things. It's not like you actually, you weren't in breach of the contract, but it's not like the contract was like some document you refused to challenge. Yeah. It's like why do kids procrastinate on their homework, you know? It's probably a similar thing where it's like for me. But if a kid could be like, actually, I don't have to, I can turn it in whenever I want. Yes. Which is like effectively what these contracts mean anyway. Yeah. There's something about it. It's like, I'm just wondering if there's like a little bit of imposter syndrome in you that's like, you don't think it's real until you've like brought someone else in. Probably a part of looking for like a stamp of approval that like, this is worth your time. Also like outsourcing that part of it as well. Yeah. And so I think that like with videos as I've gone along, it's gone from like originally I created them because I really loved creating them. I still love creating them. But then eventually it becomes more of a business where I have like a contract with advertisers to say, hey, you need to produce this many videos per year. And then it's I'm a professional videographer at this point. And so there's like that nature of it. And so I think with a book, it's you are looking for somebody to tell you, this is a good enough idea to spend a lot of time on. And I think that that can come from like a self-motivated place if you have the bandwidth to like have that capacity. But I think in a truncated manner, I'm looking for something to say, hey, give this some time when there's a lot of other responsibilities on horizon. What video thing is interesting to me because like I'm wondering if like having a slot, like a sponsor helps you get out of your own head. I'm not like piling on them. Yeah. I think this is actually a thing a lot of people have, right? You're like, if it has to go out by by Sunday, it goes out by Sunday, even though it doesn't have to. And you could call the people and be like, hey, I don't have it this week. And they'd be like, fine. But there's something about that thing just like just slightly enough that it gets you out of your own head in a way that makes you more productive. And by the way, I've never seen anything that you've done. And I thought like that seemed rushed. He was clearly just doing that to like check a box. That's like the opposite of what your things do. So I'm just wondering what that is. It is helpful. I think like there's like a perfectionist nature to it as anybody that like creates anything I think comes to. So like I could tinker on a video for a year and still be tinkering on it and tinkering on it. And so I think that like having that deadline is helpful. And like I think looking to you like you are like a machine where you have a book every year, which is helpful. And like we both know authors some close to a set of tinkered on books for a very long time and not made a lot of progress on those books. I was just reading Camus the plague and this guy's like he's been working on the first sentence in this book for like 10 years or something. And it's like you look at all the different iterations of the sentences. And they're like all like solid bees. By the way, it doesn't matter. Yeah. But like that's what happens. You just get in your own head about it. I think with even going back to my book like in full transparency, like I pushed the book in numerous times. And I think that it got to a point where basically the publisher is like if you push again, we will cancel the contract. And so then I got the book done suddenly. Yeah. And so sometimes it does take that person that like, you know, you're going to get this done like that third party. And that could probably be like a accountability partner. I know a lot of people have like success having like writing partners in that case. There's also I remember Tim Ferris told me about this website where you're like, okay, like you have to put you put like a $1,000 in escrow. And if you like, don't meet the deadline, it like gives the money to like the KKK or something. You would never want that. And so, so like it just if forces some like horrifying possibility upon you, that if you don't finish or starter, whatever it is, it will yeah. Everybody's individual, right? And it's like, I've come to learn that a little bit. And as you because even though you know that, like I need some type of like deadline, somebody else telling me that this is what I need to be focusing on. Otherwise, like I focus on the other things that somebody else is told me that with. But it's funny because like I don't think anyone would look at you and be like, oh, that's definitely not a self starter. Like you're you're perennially self-employed. You started multiple business, built most of what you have done at Saragordo or other projects, like not only did did nobody ask you to do it or tell you to do it, but like they told you would be impossible. And it wouldn't work. And like it was only by self motivation. So that's the other thing is it's like usually I guess I would take some solace in it. It's like most of the people who are high achievers also struggle with like high amounts of procrastination and excuses and parallelization and perfectionism. But it's interesting that you like sometimes you struggle with it. In some cases, you clearly struggle with it. And then in other cases, it's like preposterously not an issue for you. I mean, I'm fortunate in the fact that like all these things that we're discussing are things that I want to do. Yeah. So none of them are things I inherently do not want to do. And so like it's not that I'm pushing them off because I don't want to do it. It's just I'm pushing off because like I have this checklist of a lot of other things. And I do think and this is the nature of life, right? Like if the book sold tomorrow, I would find the time to write it in addition to everything else. But did you think like because you you sent it out and you didn't get all the responses you wanted. Yeah. If someone had said we're in. Yeah. For one dollar. Yeah. I would have been totally different than this kind of middle-ing response that you got. And it's like in consequential distinction. I do I do think a lot of this imposter syndrome. So like the idea of just writing a book on spec, right? Just writing a book feels like every person in the world is this I'm going to write a book, you know? And then it's suddenly just like the writing a book. But that's how I did Trust My Mung. I mean, my whole life changed because I basically quit my job, moved across the country and worked for six months on a book thing that yeah, no one was asking for and no one thought would work, right? Yeah. So I yeah, I wonder if in retrospect that was delusion. Was that confidence? Was that or maybe I just wasn't thinking about it at all? Was it lack of like you have a lot more in your plate these days? You know what I mean? That's true. But I remember some of the stuff. What somebody said to me, they were like, look, you'll either sell it. Yeah. Or you'll sell, publish it. So either way, it's going to come out and it's worth you doing. Yeah. And I just remember that being very freeing. I was like, okay, I'll just get started. Which is like the main thing. It wasn't like two months in. None of this was a problem. Right. But it was just the like, should I or should I? That's where you're held up. I think going as in Poshers into two, it's like this book that I'm hoping to write is more like a like a narrative fiction. It's a bigger swing. It's more of a writing book more than like less than anything else. And so like I want a outlet that distinguishes between writers and non-writers to say that they're a writer, you know what I mean? And some way you let the finished product settle that discussion. Like I guess what I'm saying is like, why don't you just take the somewhat ambivalent response that you got and use it as fuel to be like, oh, I'm going to show you that I can do. I definitely that's something part of it. I like I know the name of every publisher that passed on it, including the editor. And so we'll cut to this when the book's a big best seller. And like I'll send them a clip in this clip. If you're selling online or out of a storefront full-time or a side hustle, you know it's a challenge. People got to find you. You got to wait for them to walk in. 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Not me. I guess my wife does. My kids sometimes like bugs, but I don't like bugs in my house. Right. I don't like them around my food. I don't like them crawling on me. I don't like bugs. And the problem is you see one bug and then you ignore it and all of a sudden you got hundreds of bugs and you got an infestation. If you are looking for DIY pest control, check out today's sponsor. That's Pestee. They're making protecting your home from unwanted pests super simple. With Pestee, you can get started at 35 bucks of treatment and get a customized plan based on your location, bugs and climate. They send you everything you need. Prograde pesticide. That's the same stuff. The pros use. They give you a spray or they give you a mixing bag gloves and instructions and you can complete the whole thing in less than 10 minutes. My wife loves bugs, which she also loves our animals. And so she's always worried that killing the bugs will kill the animals. Well, Pestee pesticides are fully registered and have been used in hospitals and schools all over the country. And you can try Pestee totally risk-free with their 100% bug free guarantee or your money back. If the bugs don't go away, you get a free refund. Bugs hate to see you coming with Pestee. Just go to pestee.com slash dog for an extra 10% off your order. That's P-E-S-T-I-E. dot com slash dog for an extra 10% off. Flip in the table. You know me very well. You've known me for almost 15 years, which is our belief. You understand what I'm capable of and also what I struggle with. Given that I have the things that we outlined before, the responsibilities of the brush check, blah blah. What do you think I should do? I think you should say, like, hey, I'm going to give this a certain amount of time per day or per week. And then you're going to be like, I'm going to give it one hour a day for, you know, for all of 2025. And just see where it is then. Like that's what I was telling you is like most of like you can either spend a lot of time trying to make it more appealing to get the selection or to get chosen and then still have to be at the exact same starting line. Like you can either qualify for the marathon or you can just be like, look online and be like, this is the course I'm going to run the marathon and see if I measure up or not. You know, like I would just, I would just start by like putting some time in because who knows, maybe you'll get into it and be like, actually I really don't want to do this. It's really not that satisfying that I think I would just set aside a certain amount of time and put that time into it. And then knowing that like if you do that, not only will eventually a book come out of the other side that you'll either sell or self-publish, but if you back up and you see it as a meta project of solving this tendency that you have, that would be good because this isn't the only place you're doing it. Like again, not to put you on the spot, but you've been talking about this podcast idea, which I think is just as good as the book for like 18 months. Yeah. You're this close to start. You have most, I've recorded episodes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the record of it. It does. I think some of the two is like fear of future bandwidth, meaning like I'm afraid as I take these things on, if they are successful, then that's even more I have to do, you know what I mean? And like I'm not a post-work. I work very hard. It worked very long, but it's like, I don't know, as a thing out of that. That could be something. Well, no, this is something that I just saw a repeat when I was in New York. He came in my talk the 90th Secretary Y and he's talked about as a bunch where like, he's really like working out. He's fast. Anybody personal trainers, like saying personal trainers will talk about women. They don't want to hire a personal trainer because they don't want to get too strong. Like they're worried about looking too strong. And it's like, like the definition of like crosses bridge when you come to it. It's like the problem is, is that most people sign up and then don't come. The problem is that most people come and get too good of a result too quickly. And then they don't know what to do about it. Right. Right. And so like I get that where you're like, there's probably some level where subconsciously you're like, I don't want to start this thing because then what if it works and then all that. But like you'll cross that bridge the same way you've crossed every one of those bridges with daily stoke, which is like now you have a scaling problem, which are actually uniquely qualified and practiced at solving. Yeah. That's true. Well, I think generally if we also talk about it, like I'm probably not the only person in the world that has a book idea that's good that is failing to start because somebody else is saying yes, what would you say to everybody else out there that has a book idea that hasn't started? Well, Senator, I'll put you on the hot seat here because Santa Kiss is the one thing that all fools have in common is they're always getting ready to start. And that's where it's not like you're like some that you're like you're you are working on it. Yeah, you're just like waiting for some like you're waiting for like the the bell to go off to start and that's not probably going to happen. Like for any of the things, you know, like nobody's hotly anticipating like anything that any of us are doing. Like it's all got to be self driven. That's true. So not to put you on the seat. Don't you ever feel though that like it becomes an obligation meaning like even this podcast for instance, right? Like you now know that you have to do I go like, Hey, like just like maintenance on the things that I've committed to is like X amount of hours per week, right? And then like the commute to getting my kids at school is X there's like increasingly smaller windows, which is definitely a self-inflicted yeah, like sort of tighter and tighter pressure cooker that I've put myself in. So I definitely see that, but like I do try to I do try to separate like, okay, what is like a work commit like, okay, like I'm squeezing in one more talk that I'm supposed to do next week like we're recording this before the end of the year. People are probably listening to this at the beginning of the year, which is sort of what we're talking about because we're talking about like probably already you failed at some of your resolutions. And that's why we redo the new year new challenge, which you can sign up for it. DailyStoke.com slash challenge, but I'm like squeezing in one more thing before the end of the year. That's like I probably shouldn't it's whatever I do that, but like I try to make a big distinction between like obligations and then like interests slash creative like the main. So it's like if I like I just had this idea for another book that's kind of like an in-between book and I pitched it to my publisher on Monday when I was in New York and they were like like let's do it, you know, and like that to me like when I look back I'm not going to be like I'm glad I squeezed in that extra talk, but I am going to be glad that I like work on that cool thing I was excited about. So like if it's something that you don't ever actually want to do and then you're like reticence to start it is probably a good sign. Yeah, right? I think that's it. Like if it's not a hell yes for something that like sucks. Yeah, that's different than like I'm not sure if I should do it or not do it, but like deep down you're like I would love to have done that. Right, right. Those are the things you have to like barrel through the procrastination. Right. I'll give you another one. There's like an email on my inbox from this like start up that wants me to invest in it and like the guys work really nice and I was like I almost signed the paperwork five times. Yeah, that I'm more suspicious of I guess I'm taking my procrastination as meaning something more there. Yeah, then I am when I'm like I'm in the middle of this project to announce really hard and challenging and I'm like looking for an excuse not to do it. Yeah, that procrastination I'm barreling through. Right. Or resistance I want to see as the enemy versus other resistance that it's like no, that's like a spooky feeling warning you like you're in dangerous territory. Right. With the hell yes or hell no if we're Derrick's you know he said yeah things are either hell yes or hell no I think part of this too is like as you become more successful the hell knows are things that you previously would have set hell yes to that's a great point. Sure. And so like this book idea had come to me five years ago before I had a huge channel I would have been 100% and on that and as you become more successful in other areas the trade off you start doing a little bit more. That's what the opportunity cost is yeah for sure. Yes and if you had some competing thing that was like real and concrete and whatever that would be different. Yeah. Also I think but it's a genuinely good idea. It's like something you would grow for having done. Yeah. And the downside of it is extremely low other than opportunity costs. Yeah. I don't know I probably pushed through. I've also worn where like I haven't not been working I've been quietly working on it maybe I was working out till I get to the point where I feel like oh I've actually been working on it you know. Yes. Yes. I have the prologue and the chapter one written already. Oh. And so there is work behind the scenes and so that I think is like an indication even on myself that I do want to do the thing. Yeah. But it would still be nice to have like a publisher be like you're all right. The book is like this one big thing that you work on for many years and then maybe it works or it doesn't. The podcast is a more I think illustrative and relatable one because like you could be 50 episodes into it by now and having like either you could have either done it and turned out like your audience isn't interested in it and you're not interested in it or you could be 50 stories in it could be incredible. It could have gotten you whatever cred and security you needed to do the book like yeah you also just could have been whoever you are on the other side of doing 50 episodes of something. That's true. So that's like an interesting one because it's closer to what most people are doing which is like iterative things that they're either starting or not starting the clock on. I've done about 10 episodes and the point of that was like I remember when Tim Ferriss started his podcast he was like I'm gonna get it 10 or whatever you said yeah I do six and that feel when you make it a more manageable thing it is more manageable. You still then have to put them out but again that's still like to me I'm like well if I do six I'm gonna have to do 600 you know I mean and then like if he comes like a growing thing but yeah so there is is that the imposter syndrome of not wanting to launch it and it doesn't do like are you because that's an interesting thing you and I talked about this where like we knew someone who was like wanted to be a youtuber but they just never made any videos and we were talking about how you have to it's not ego exactly but you have to have whatever the thing is that allows you to do your first shitty stuff yeah that is public like all having said all the first draft of anything is but like the problem with a lot of stuff is that that unlike a manuscript that draft gets seen by people and are you struggling then which is not wanting to put something out and getting feedback on it like like you are so good at making videos are you is it more like you don't know if you're gonna be good at this maybe yeah maybe I think that like I was pretty fortunate we're like my videos have done really well from the very beginning and so like I can point to them and look I'm good at making something and then if you don't good at making something else like does that but why don't you like okay the videos came out they did well the email list came out it did great why is your assumption that it won't be the third one in a row I don't know I don't know I remember I was talking about someone that they were gonna like help me with some of my financial stuff and I was like I kept being like you know because then like this is gonna go away and then I'm and he was like but what if like I think it was actually right when I was thinking about the four virtue series I was like you know this is the first time I'm selling four things in a row in the way the money works in publishing you get like a chunk of it yeah so I was like so obviously this is a one-time thing and then it's probably done for me like this is my like and he was like but what if it's not like he was just like he was like what if the next one is bigger and like I couldn't conceive of the and obviously him having other clients like he'd worked with a bunch of professional athletes like they're always like my first contract it's the the biggest one but he'd just seen it enough times like no sometimes like you keep going yeah and like that was like hard for me to conceptualize I wonder if you're like the track records as new you should be good this too not from an egotistical standpoint but like you have an audience you're good at it yeah it should transfer a little bit like there's some of that I mean I remember even when I was doing my my book that came out like I didn't I don't think I showed anybody drafts other than you at the very last minute yeah and I was like why don't I show them drafts it's like that's the dumbest thing ever because like they're gonna see the final book yeah and it's only gonna be worse because you did this show anybody drafts it's like I was hiding all the work from everybody including like like closest friends and family help you make it better yeah instead I was like no I don't want to show them something that's not good and instead they saw like a book that could have been better had I shown people things earlier on that's how you should think about this podcast too because it's like only a small percentage of the eventual audience will listen to the early ones so like we talk about this at the day sogmas and like start the clock yeah like you should start like who you're gonna be a year in and two years in and five years in is like obviously much better than who you are at the beginning sure so like if you'd started the clock a year ago you'd be one year in yeah I agree with that I mean I think to take the focus off myself a little bit probably many many many people struggle with this exact thing totally yeah so that's why I'm to I think it's just 90% of people out there probably have some creative project that they've thought about and failed to begin for some reason and I think it happens what is that for you what is the podcast in your version of that world you know the I don't know I have to think about like creatively like what is that saying one example like I have I've just noticed it like practically lately like they'll be like an email for some like like I'm having a handle like some legal paperwork or I'm gonna clean something up or have to make a decision about something and I'll see this like email come in and I'll be like oh that's gonna be like uh that's a high mental load thing so I'll procrastinate I won't open it and then I'm opening it and the person's like can you send me that thing again and so it's like like actually it was like uh we weren't at the part I was treading it was like something leading up to that part but I just made the whole thing last longer by by like making it up in my head you know um like there was some decision I sam and I have to make on something and I was like we're like putting it off putting it off and then it was like actually like the examples that they showed us were like so far from what we could choose between that we had to send it back yeah and so like we could have sent it back two weeks ago and then it would be finished faster and whatever like I just find myself doing that a lot like mostly over like a low stake stuff yeah I'm just like letting stuff sit and pile up and then I feel more and more pressure and then when I look at them I'm like this was a low pressure thing that I yeah projected onto it something I was trying to avoid yeah I don't know like big things I'm procrastinating on I don't actually don't think that much I'm pretty good at that yeah it's more the little things more than my goals for for 20 26 maybe I'll have already failed at this by the time people are listening but I'm gonna I'm gonna declare email bankruptcy what was that like you're do I go to the Luxio just delete everything that I'm just gonna mark it all is like all is that and I've been telling myself I'm gonna do it for like where are you right now well okay so like I have an email I have like two emails as you know I have one email that like newsletters go to and like hey we need an email address for this receipt that because yeah so that has like 50,000 unread email that's like I never asked for most of those emails so that is account but I have like my email yeah it's got like five or six hundred but they're like serious important emails yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and they stretch back two or three years at this point and I'm just gonna like obviously none of them are important or they would have replied to begin yeah yeah and honestly I bet there's like certain people are certain things that if I just search that name and mark to those as red yeah it would go they're 60% of it or yeah because it's them following up about this date like 10 times you know or whatever but um like so it's more like that is there's like things I know I need to do that I'm letting pile up and and I'm like even this the center goes thing right I'm telling myself I'm gonna do it right January 1st yes I could just walk into my office and do it right now yes but on January 1st it'll be 10% larger yeah yeah you know correct so it'd be better if I did it right now yeah well you should do something called the New Year New Year John in the spirit of it's never too late we are breaking with a little bit of tradition over at daily stoic and reopening the New Year New Year challenge we usually kick off the year with 21 days of stoic inspired challenges and we heard from a bunch of people they came back from vacation late they procrastinated or they changed their mind or they stumbled on their resolution and well we wanted to say it's not too late you're still working on yourself you're trying to get better you want to make changes and this is all inspired by stoic wisdom so I would love to see you in there break out of the doom loop cultivate gratitude take charge of the year focus more develop confidence find calmness and stillness in a crazy world a bunch of great stuff in here it is not too late to make 2026 your best year stop dreaming and you know be that person well you can sign up right now at daily stoic.com slash challenge and I will see it in there we've got a bunch of awesome stuff I think you're really going to like it so sign up now at daily stoic.com slash challenge I'll see you in there I think we may have built a day around that for this reason like what's a task you've been you've been putting off like what's one thing you're doing well I guess like within the stoic like if I had to hold on to something to convince me to do my book yeah what am I holding on to I mean what I would hold on to is like the whole sir or order could burn down to the ground again you know like I mean you could fall down a fucking mine shaft yeah all these and these are not like extremely unlikely a possibility yes like one of them is a thing that already happened once yes and another one is a fate you tempt on a regular basis so and that's not even getting into other possibilities which is like I don't know you're not going to be the person who has the freedom that you have now forever sure I don't agree with that and like so this is like the time to do right so how then so for a very practical example this winter I had like three months dedicated and I was either you know I filled up like 50 percent of it so it's something else I was either going to write this book full time yeah full time meaning in my spare free time yeah or go on a road trip where that is a guaranteed paycheck yeah it's gonna guarantee go to the brewery building the hotel will guarantee advance my goals at Sarogordo sure and so the proposal didn't get the response I wanted it to the road trip got an immediate sponsorship for the whole series of it and so now I'm spending these three months doing a road trip which I'm excited about but at the same time you know what I mean like well I think two things I don't think your road trip actually needs to take three months and then and then and no one actually said that you have to do it all by car this true even you know famously when you read like walk in the woods or like it's like three different trips they are I mean like no one no one actually needs you to do a contiguous road trip like park your car in an airport and fly home and whatever so I think I think not needing it to all or nothing is another way that we excuse procrastination like I don't I just don't have the headspace right now or like I can't dedicate as much time as I would like to it right now so I'm just not going to which is horseshit right it's like and that leads me to the main thing I was saying earlier which is like tell yourself that one is contingent on the other that accepting this is contingent on you saying hey I'm going to wake up at six in the morning every day of the trip and I'm gonna write from six to seven six seven yeah that's what that's probably by the time this is it so I wake up at this this how you know I have a nine year old and six year old that's what I would I would make you know like I will allow myself this which is important and responsible for like adult business reasons right but I'm only gonna accept that if I use it to support what I've committed to do for like creative fulfillment meaning purposes like that because I think it's very easy for everybody to fill available space with anything right and especially like we said like as you have success you can fill with they're both very cool things to do you know they're not like one's not undesirable to do and so I have no problem filling my days with many plenty of things that are really cool which is a very fortunate position to be in a lot of people have this fantasy that they're going off in the and that's where they that's what they need to finish their look why do you hate writers retreats? I mean I hate writing retreats because it's it's basically an expensive form of procrastination it's it's fantasy camp you are saying I could be writing right now I could have written this morning I could write tomorrow morning but actually I need to save it up for like three weeks when I go to this expensive place in upstate New York or or when I go to this glamorous cabin in the woods and like you're just looking for an escape from the day to dayness that is doing the thing the idea that you're going to get a book done in two weeks or in a month in a sprint it's like the whole thing was never a sprint to begin with it's a marathon right it's a long extended endurance sport and there might be punctuated moments of intensity sure but like that's probably not what's going to happen and in fact you're not doing it day to day because you're saving it up for this period when you're really going to be ready I'm like I'm like you know Baldwin was obsessed with these writing retreats and then he would go and mostly drink and talk on the foot he would call his his boyfriends and he would whoever you are here you're going to be where you're going it's you're just paying for it and it's a slightly more glamorous setting and you're going to be telling yourself that this is contributive and it's not and so I think mostly it's dumb and mostly it's like go to your office go to a coffee shop sit in your car on do it on your phone like just just do it and do it a couple crappy pages a day and eventually you have a manuscript that can be turned into not crap but don't you ever have the the fantasies for me like right my fantasy is winter a publisher this was going to be your writers retreat you're coming here yeah yeah so like publisher gives you an advance I come to somewhere where no one's bothering me better weather better weather or I was like you know for only a crazy all rent a cabin in Key West you know I'll yeah I'll see it in a way you know I like the aura of the place will get to me and like but haven't at some point in your career you have fallen victim at all like wanting to live the lifestyle what we perceive to be a writer well first up how's the writing retreat going for you your art you're you're leaving in two days to drive thousands of miles over the country did not do the thing that you did not right specifically said you're gonna do I mean yeah sure yeah and look sometimes it is nice to be in a cool spot like and I like taking my stuff with me when I'm already going somewhere and I'll get a little bit here there it can be fun sometimes but it's mostly a day to day thing and there's no escape there's no hack there I would almost count on the destination writing fostering creative I would I would say like you're actually paying for it to be worse it's like they say like when you take your kids on vacation you're paying to not have childcare that's like what you're doing so like it's actually much less relaxing that's how I would that said you've lived in what many would consider writing hotspots you lived in New York City you lived in LA you live in New Orleans you lived in Austin you lived in Florida sure and so what is the best place to write my friend Chase Jarvis has the best cameras the one that you have on you like the best place to write is wherever you are whenever you have time I would say the best the best place to write is like early in the morning or late at night wherever the fuck you happen to be and everything else is window dressing and fantasy and pretending and nonsense but sure like there's a reason I live outside Austin as opposed to you know wherever and there's a reason I have an office instead of at a coffee shop there ways you're turning the dials a little bit but there's not a button you can press or a ticket you can buy or a fellowship you can give that's going to make you do this hard thing that is mostly only yours to do and if there was a magical solution someone would have figured it out right yeah so none of those cities do it for you I mean no more than any other place I I think no more than any other place because it's not about the the the one thing they all have in common is you and as they say like wherever you go there you are isn't there is narrative that like you go to Gertrude Shines apartment in Paris and you suddenly become a great writer so like seeing a Joan Didian's table is it doing anything for you I literally sit in Joan Didian's chair every day it's pretty uncomfortable to be perfectly honest and that's all that's all very silly like James Clear talked to me about he's like two magical hours that's all he asked for himself it's like he did it's like the first two hours and that's that's how I do it like most of us are not Robert Carro or Robert Green or whatever you're working like for 12 hours a day on this insane project for 10 years like and by the way most of what we're trying to do does not demand that like we're not trying to solve complex theoretical physics either so we don't need to do what Richard Feynman is doing so I think like just the decision to go like ham and spend this amount of time on a day and a day out basis like if you can do that you'll eventually get where you want to go and in this case because you don't have a contract you don't have a time like it doesn't have to be done by any time and it's not like anyone's going to scoop you on this idea and it's not like it's becoming any more or less relevant it's a timeless idea about a thing that you have a monopoly on and you're one of the only people in the world that even knows about like just do just chip away at it the funny thing is like the thing that you think will give you permission or make it easier doesn't actually solve that logistical problem at all because like let's say actually one of the people who went out to got back late and they're like no no I want it and it's a great art you still have this other thing and you probably still would have had this other thing anyway and you'd be like well what order should I do them in and you'd be like I gotta do both and then so it just comes down to just like fucking do it you know what I mean like just this is a say to yourself you're gonna do it I think epic teetus I think I actually have this as the epigraph to the daily dad this is epic teetus is first say to yourself what you would be and then do what you have to do like what's the thing that you want to do and then you you do it and then all right so how about this all go back and mark unread on all those emails yes and you will schedule the first episode everything deal subscribe below I'm only nagging you about these two things too because I want you to do both of them like I think they're both really good ideas and I would like to consume them I'm very excited about both of them even though I'm not well I am pursuing both of them in like my own timid way and I do think that also though like the road trip will feed into both in some way maybe so I think that it'll be end up pretty good what I wonder to like if I'm like psychoanalyzing you I think it's less like you're worried about like the commitment in the future like if you do the thing then it's like you have this thing I think you kind of have a good not a good setup but you have a you have a perfectly unscalable setup now it's mostly you the handful of people it all runs through you there's no hierarchy organization structure it's just like you waking up and what am I gonna do today and there's probably some level where like operationalizing it the way that ironically that's been your role with Daily Stoke is like I have ideas and then you help me operationalize them into like I was like hey we're doing the email it's going well but like what if we did a podcast version like for people don't know Branson one that like makes the things real for the most part there's probably some level where you are either afraid to do that for yourself or you are intimidated by the idea of having to get someone to help you do that I think so I think that the idea of like because with that seemingly comes more responsibility because then you're responsible for another person and then another person and and you're like wait I have two yeah yeah I have the things yeah so it's partially that but it's like it's weird too because like I think all people are as I was just like I watched the things you know I want the podcast to be doing well I want the book to be under development it's just something about like well that's what he's saying is like what do I have to be or what do I want and then you're like yeah then you had to do what you you know you you know what you have to do yeah so you just have to do that thing yeah what's it it's also like and probably you could speak to this as well especially to the authors like my first book did well the next book that I want to do is not in the same genre of the first book it's further from home I can bear I mean what do you think my book does it mean like let's do a philosophy book to follow up this marketing hit and so like when you feel like you did a good job within the space but then the response to your next idea is like tap it you know it's like a little bit can't speak to me why we're selling book it's one of if not my favorite book of yours that's why I'm saying but I and I can say that very competently like I'm in in many respects proud of it yeah and like the book that I'm working on now if it works right it will probably also be one of my worst selling books like success is like a foregone conclusion sure not as good as the other ones but you got to know where different things fit yeah but then also like what I know is that day to day I'm fucking loving doing it because like I it's what I wanted to do it's what I'm interested in and I'm learning so I'm like oh it's like it's success even if I was doing it for even if it was a money losing project yeah which I guess at some point if you're like advance and then the the the advances here and then like the the expenses of research and time or whatever at some point it does become a money losing proposition thankfully we're nowhere close to that but like I'd be like okay no because like I'm I'm making withdrawals too and then I'm like liking what I'm doing every day yeah thanks so much for listening if you could rate this podcast and leave a review on iTunes that would mean so much to us and it would really help the show we appreciate it and I'll see you next episode you