2834: 5 Fitness Influencers Worth Following (And Why Most of Everyone Else is Lying to You)

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Again, you can get all of that included 40% off. Mapsppl.com, the code is PPL. All right, real quick, if you love us like we love you, why not show it by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs, or training gear over at MindPumpStore.com. I'm talking right now, hit pause, head on over to MindPumpStore.com. That's it. Enjoy the rest of the show. 99.9% of fitness influencers on social media are total garbage. It's true. Don't follow them to lead you in the wrong direction. Yeah, that's pretty true. Okay, so if you were to give the audience five influencers in the fitness space regarding exercise, science, or nutrition in that direction, what are five people they should be following? That's a good question. Okay, so it is true that most... You only get five. I'm sure we could go all day long. Yes, so I'll put some... Give me five that everybody should be following. I'll do some qualifiers, right? So we'll name some people who are really good with the exercise part of fitness, right? So not like they do good nutrition stuff too, but people you'd want to follow when it comes to workout style advice. And I'll stand by what I said. Most influencers on social media don't promote good advice, don't do a good job leading people to right that way, but there are people who are good that are out there, so I'll name some. So, Joda Franco, Brett Contreras, Ben Bruno, Jordan Syed, Don Saladino, those would be five off the top of my head, like kind of fitness people that give some good information that I would say give them a follow. I love that. And what... Okay, there's some super common themes amongst them, although very different. Yeah, throw different. You get some sport specific information there, you get some general pop, you get some like hypertrophy, like... You don't... I find that they all have in common though, that really, really well. Nuance. Yes, well, okay, right. So... And to go deeper, they all have a lot of experience training a lot of people. And that's why I think they do such a good job. Yeah, which comes with the nuance. That's right, because you're gonna have to... So like, let's start with the first one I mentioned was I think was... Yeah, they're actual trainers. I started with Joe, right? Joda Franco. He's been training people for a long time. I think we all looked up to him when we were personal trainers years ago. Yeah, when I was in college. Yeah, I loved his content. And what I like about Joe is he's so good with the nuance. He's so good at explaining why something may be true sometimes, but not always. Or that one video, Adam, where somebody was criticizing an athlete for the way that they were being trained and saying, well, that's why they got injured. And he did such a great job going in and really breaking down the truth. And he did it in a very... I mean, perfect sense. Yeah, these guys all... Another thing that I find in common with all of them is all of them were great trainers before social media came. Good point. But long before social media came, they were already good coaches and trainers. Then social media came and then eventually they were found and became popular and all for different reasons. They didn't do it to get popular on social media. What a great point. I think a fitness influencer who's a media first, trainer second, bad. You know, because you're right. All these guys, all these people were training people for a long time. And even to take it like to give some credit to... It doesn't necessarily... They're bad. Just they're not as good. I mean, because you could have... You could have came up and the... It's not to say that anybody who's younger, who came up in the social media world and they got famous through social media and we came down to... They can't be a good coach, but everybody that you listed made their bones in coaching people in real life first and was already successful doing that without needing social media. Social media just blew up. The ones on social media, it's like great information can receive that sometimes, but they don't have that experience to back it and the way to navigate through that when you're troubleshooting. Okay. So since we're talking about these five people, that I would consider friends of ours, let's talk about what you like about each of them individually. Well, so Joe, Joe, he's an OG and he understands, especially exercise performance training and nuance around that. And he was talking about things that now I think we take for granted that a lot of athletes or athletic trainers utilize. He was big on the sled before people were making that a big deal. Yeah, he was. Yeah, he understands how to apply explosive style training in the proper context. He understands range of motion in the proper context and he also communicates it very well. He communicates like a guy you would just talk to. Now, he doesn't talk over your head, even though the dude is super intelligent and knows his stuff. I found that interesting that you chose these, I only gave you five to choose from and some people might be like, oh, what about someone? We have a lot of other friends that are very intelligent, have their own certifications, you know, and are brilliant. You limited it to five to. Yeah. And, and, and, but I do like the list that you put together for where I'm going with this is that there's definitely some of our friends that are more science heavy. But one of the things I love about Joe is Joe is brilliant, but then also communicates in a way that the average person can understand and go, oh, that makes a lot of sense why I do that. And I think that's such a valuable trait. I'm sure I'm a bit biased because I think I'm I lean more in this direction than the science heavy guy. Like I think communication and getting your clients to apply or change behavior is far more important than can I argue or debate with you about a study that proves me more right? And Joe has the ability to do both, which is so great, which makes him a superpower. Yeah. Now Brett Contreras, speaking science, I think he does a great job with taking science and combining it with his, his experience. He does a really good job. And one thing I like about Brett is he, he won't die on a hill. If there's a study or something that kind of proves maybe his opinion was wrong, so rare to find that's right, or he'll go conduct studies themselves. Now this guy became famous popularizing the hip thrust. In fact, he would say he was one of the first people to do this as a strength building, butt building exercise. And I would agree. I never really heard of the hip thrust and the way that he talks about it until he did. And he also does a great job communicating traditional, heavy strength training to women. He does a great job because he's got all these female athletes or these female competitors that train under him. And he's proven like, nah, build muscle, get strong. That's the way to go. Yeah. I mean, you could make it, you could make a pretty fair argument that women that lift really heavy weights, the majority talking about this, obviously this is an overgeneralization, but a bulk of that movement came from CrossFit and Brett Contreras. Yes. Good point. I mean, probably are responsible for a large percentage of women that are not afraid to lift heavy ass weight. The other thing too about Brett is of all, he's probably the most science heavy at everybody that you listed, but also communicates in a very simple way, even though he has a very high level understanding of all the science, which makes him also a superpower too, is that he can get in there and argue and debate with the best of them and has read all the literature and knows most all of it like the back of his hand, but then also can communicate to the average person to get his point across and help somebody out. So I love that too. Totally. And then Ben Bruno. One of my favorites. Yeah. Well, first of all, he's got a great personality. He's hilarious. But he's like a very much like a train. Like he's like a trainer's trainer. Yeah. He's like a really good trainer who's worked with a lot of everyday people. And you know, when you talk to him, because I would say of all these people up here, I probably relate the closest to him, because that's what I trained a lot of was just everyday people. Well, most people, the iron, the irony though about Ben is that Ben has trained a lot, but he's also most of his list of celebrities and athletes. Yeah, like high level athletes, high level. He has everything. I think one of the why we probably all connect so much to Ben that he really focuses on behavior type stuff and practicality. And he's very much so a realist in like understanding that I've trained enough people who have tried all the things and understand all the science and all that shit doesn't matter if they don't continue to show up every day and do the thing. And from all the years and years and probably close to thousands of people that he's interacted with has distilled it down to this is the stuff that works. I don't give a shit about your study that proves your way might be a better way in a clinical master of the application. Right. Right. In a clinical setting, I know what works with people and I know how to get people results and I know how to keep. And by the way, he'll explain it well. Yeah, we'll say here's why that doesn't work in the real world. Yeah. And he has a good job because you know, he's, he's applied it. That's what I mean. He's applied it and he's done it. And so, yeah, Ben, Ben's one of my favorite up there for sure. I love that you picked him because very, very relatable, really great guy. Also, too, another thing that I think that's important to point out about him and maybe arguably, I'd put a couple of these other guys in that list too. Ben is really involved in his, his place to a lot of people in fitness, even the experts in the best have these deep rooted insecurities that have propelled them to be these experts. That is what's driven them to be obsessed with the gym, obsessed with the information, obsessed with all of it. So it gives them kind of their superpower. Ben is not that guy. Ben is very much so a very normal dude that wants to say, and I think that is so relatable and helpful to the average person who wants to stay in shape. And so that, to me, he's very evolved as a coach and trainer. Obviously, probably criticized by peers that are obsessed with the way they look or the PRs that they're doing. He don't give a shit. And that's what I mean. But super high performance, based through super aesthetic base. He's just, yeah, he, he again, too. And I think a lot of the best coaches, well, the most of the coaches I know, were the struggling athlete or the struggling person that like really wanted to figure it out and like worked really hard to get to that point. And it's like, they realized that their real gift is coaching. That's why I think that's what one of the things I like about Ben, that's what I meant. Like when he communicates, I think his content is so good for everyday people trying to get fit. Like everyday people trying to get fit, watch his stuff. It's going to be very valuable to you. That's just the way he communicates, which is good. Jordan Syon, we got him next. He's great. He's great. I think he's got great. Now he is actually really good at social media, but he was again a trainer way before he just, he got good because he was, he was Gary V's coach. So he got the opportunity to train Gary V before anybody knew who he was. And Gary V spit game to him on the social media side. And then he got good at that, but he was already a good coach. He is a great coach. He's also a coach of coaches. So it's good for trainers to follow Jordan. And he has a community, I think of trainers, right? That he works with and he does a great job of communicating, you know, complicated, you know, stuff into very simple terms. Again, that's a theme that you're going to see with all these guys. He's also a great guy. And he's a very hardworking, very honest, very hardworking trainer, probably one of the hardest people working trainers that I've met in the space. Also, I put him in that category with Ben Bruno too, a very evolved with like, he's, he's been super, you know, ripped and strong as shit. Like he's, he's done the thing. Like he's done crazy feats, but he doesn't live in that space. Like he cares more about being a father and healthy and balanced and helping people and, you know, enjoying life and the nice thing. And so I think that does a really good job of communicating overall health and fitness and cutting through a lot of the bullshit that's out there. And also well read too. Like he knows his studies, he knows the science. He's very aware of that, but then communicates fitness in a very simple way that the average person can adopt it and be consistent with it. And then we got Don, Don Saladino, great guy. He's got such a great attitude of service. This is what got him initially. He's also a great trainer, of course, but what got him so popular in the celebrity world is that they felt comfortable with him because it didn't look like he was looking for anything back from them, but also communicates fitness so well, so accurately, so in such applicable ways, appropriate ways that most people could take from also just a great guy when you meet him, also very hardworking guy. But just to, just again, what deserves to be on this list. Maybe, maybe, maybe the most experience out of everybody on the list of training people, him and Joe. Joe's gotta be. Joe for sure. Yeah, Don's. I mean, I don't know though. Joe, Joe doesn't. How long has Don been doing it? Don still trains a lot of clients. Oh yeah, he's. Does Joe still train the volume of clients that Don does? Uh, I don't question. That's why I think he has a lot of coaches. Because Joe's been doing it a little bit longer, right? But I don't think Joe trains as many one-on-one clients. That's not a main business. No, but Don still is. Don still does. Don still trains a lot of clients one-on-one. And so arguably, maybe the most hours of one-on-one with people. That's tough. Joe's been doing it for a long time. I know. He's been training people since the 90s. He's been, is Joe. And so, and Don is, when did Don start? Probably, is he our age or is he younger? Don, no, Don's older. Don's older than us. He looks good. Or he's your, he's your, he's your age. He's older than me. He might have started in the 90s as well. It's a good, it's a good. Yeah, yeah. You're right. They're probably both up there. Yeah. I mean, regardless of who's a little more or less, my point is that. They're both just really. You're talking about two of the most experienced one-on-one coaches. I would say Joe a little heavier and more experienced in the, in the sports performance world. Yeah, for sure. Don a little more experienced in the average person. And so I think depending on your cup of tea, I mean, all, all five are must follows. If you don't follow them, you have to be following them. I think their content, their, the information they provide. It's real important too. I mean, one of the reasons why fitness influencers are so terrible for the most part, besides the fact that the information they often communicate is either wrong or, or not needed to be communicated. So sometimes we get a fitness influencer communicates good information, a study, but they're, but they're communicating something that's just going to confuse people and misdirect people. And so they just don't have the experience to know like, this isn't something I should sell because it actually doesn't matter. In fact, all it's going to do is turn people away. But the other reason is that fitness is so body obsessed. It's so obsessive about how you look. And it's kind of got this unhealthy underpinning that following even people with good information who, who sell things in that way can kind of make things not good. And so the fitness space in general, social media can be that way. I didn't even follow the right people. Then it's very positive. I didn't think about that either that is common with all, all five of these guys too. Like none of them use their physique to sell. Not their physique. No, Brett will, will show his, his women that he trains, but that's what he does. Yeah, but it's him and his Jorts. He's not, he's not, I'm saying he's not, I mean, I think he's, I think he's a niche. Yeah. I think when he, I think when he had a certain milestone age, I think he presented like this is where he's at. You know, one thing I like about Brett, because he'll have the, you know, the booty model stuff on his, because that's what he trains. He trains a lot of these women that compete, but it's, he's always showing how strong they are. He's always showing like the traditional strength. So he puts a, like a good positive point with it because he knows how to train. He's breaking down the exercises. That's right. Being very specific with it. Not. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. That's right. But the point you made, Adam, I think is so, I didn't even think of that. Like they were all training people for a while first before it first. Yeah. They were all, that's what they did. This was their profession. They weren't fitness influencers. They're trainers that just so happened to come along with social media. I think that's YouTube stars. I think that's, I think that's got to be one of the hardest things for the younger, if you're, you know, younger than say 40, so 35, even younger and you're, find yourself looking for content or for good people on Instagram to be able to discern between, you know, were these people good before Instagram came out, you know, like, and like, did, did they get good, not because they're good at making, because what makes you good on Instagram is not necessarily what makes you a good coach. 100%. It does. You can be very good on Instagram and be a horrible coach. But if you were a great coach first, and then you, you happen to be a decent or famous on it, because some of them aren't, aren't even that. I'm trying to think who were the, what's still, Doug, can you pull up the following on everybody right now? I know Siad, I believe Siad's over a million. I don't think Ben is over a million. I don't know if Brett is, tell me what the following is on all of them. I'm curious to where they're all at. I think so. Who's got the low, who's got the lowest following? It'd be interesting because we were just arguing that Joe, we were arguing that Joe and Don have the most experience. Wow, Joe, Joe DeFranco, 184,000 followers. Okay. So not crazy. No, no, not at all. Brett's probably got a huge following. Yeah. Yeah. So on Celadino, let's see, he's at 428,000. Oh yeah. So he's not at a million. Brett, 1.7. So he's got a huge one. Ben Bruno. And I bet the reason why Brett is, because he's got a lot of insight. So Ben Bruno, and half a million, so 500,000. So let's see, Jordan. Jordan's over a million, I think. Is he? Yeah. Jordan's a little higher. Best one out of social media. Oh yeah. Where's he at? I can't even find him. Oh, there he is. 1.1. So Brett, a little bit more. Yeah. And then what's Don at? I bet, I think Don's the lowest. Is he? Oh, no, he's not. 428, you said? Yeah, 428. And what was Joe? Joe was only 187. Wow. How funny is that? We were giving probably Joe some of the most flowers. Yeah. And Joe is, I mean, like he's been in the game the longest out of all of them for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, they're all good. They all do a great job. And it's funny too, because we'll meet people and we'll talk with them. And, you know, when you have a lot of experiences as a coach, you can hear when someone else starts to talk and answer questions. And you go, okay, this person. Yeah. I remember Brett Contreras. We first had him on the podcast. I didn't know a ton about him, except for what he was known for. And we started talking right out the gate. He's a science guy, right? But right out the gates as he's talking, I'm like, oh, he's trained a lot of people. Oh, you know why I remember, I remember that conversation. Every time we challenge him or ask him a question that we are trying to see where he stands. And so he always started it with depends. It depends. Well, yeah, there was no, there was always nuance to the answer. And I think that's what all these guys do such a good job is they understand that, you know, there's, there's an exception to almost every rule. And by the way, I know someone will do this whenever we talk about people we really like or something like that. If you sift through, you guys should do this. Well, no, there's they'll sift through their content and find something that we don't say exactly the same or we don't say anything. It's like, you're going to find amongst even all five of these that some of them might communicate something else a little different. It doesn't make one guy right or wrong. Right. But I'd say about 99% of all of our fitness philosophy is aligned. I don't think. Well, what's true is true. Yeah, exactly. I think that there might be some different strategies that each of us have because of our backgrounds. But for the most part, I think agree with almost everything that you guys talk about. All right, I'm going to talk about a Cray team. I know we talk about them all the time, but did you get this thing I sent over to you? Did you find this study on it? So I found the study. It's not a public, I said, I can't pull up the actual study, but I found others like it that support it. But check out this study. This was a 2023 randomized control pilot study where women with major depressive disorder. So these were women with depressive disorder. They were given and a core more, they had anxiety as well. So they had this major depressive disorder and they also had anxiety. Okay. And they give them five grams of creatine a day. That's it. Normal serving, not the 15 grams that you see in some of these studies for brain health, five grams of creatine a day. Within the first week, there was a 50% decrease in anxiety. That's crazy. Some with some sources claiming up to 95% by the end of the study. Here's the deal. Anxiety is rough. Why would that, why would creatine make that, add a five gram dose make that much of a difference on anxiety and depression? If your depression and anxiety is a result of poor energy production. Energy in your brain. That's right. Or just in your body overall, right? If it's a product of poor energy metabolism, or just not being able to create enough energy for whatever reason, then increasing ATP would make you feel a lot better. Definitely. And anxiety can be that. Anxiety can, you can get anxiety from nutrient deficiencies as well. So you'll see sometimes people vitamin D deficiency. Sure. But creatine, that's not the only study, by the way. In 2012, there was a double blind study with 52 women, again, with this depressive disorder, adding creatine to their SSRI led to faster and greater reduction in depression compared to just the SSRI. So creating in combination with the SSRI was like better, much better, much faster reduction in depression. There was another study with 100 adults with depression, five grams of creatine a day plus cognitive behavioral therapy reduced depression scores more than just the cognitive behavioral therapy by itself. There's meta analysis that are done this, on this, that discuss its potential as an adjuvant, excuse me, adjunctive benefits for depression. So in combination with other therapies, it's a good idea. It's good for you. I can't imagine then how, what the result would be for someone who is battling anxiety and depression. If they, and they didn't take creatine, they all of a sudden started supplementing with five to 15 grams of creatine a day and started strength training two to three times. Strength training, now you got exercise. Because we already know what exercise does for that category coupled with creatine. It has to be. Here's what I'll have. Now here's something else. And Doug, if you could look this up, look up the rate of anxiety on, with vegans versus omnivores. So I know that vegans will suffer from higher rates of anxiety than omnivores when, when the diets are somewhat healthy. I wonder if that's, if that's creating, because you see these pretty dramatic improvements in health with, especially with vegans and creatine, because they're not getting any from, from dietary, you know, sources. Yeah. So yeah. I don't think this is what you're looking for. Yeah, there's more. There are, so there are other studies that, so meta analysis will show that higher nutrient deficiencies and anxiety and depression. Yeah. So you have to look at healthy versus healthy, by the way, not vegans versus garbage. Yeah. Omnivore diets. Yeah, that makes that makes sense. So, um, but yeah, creatine, just one of those, if you have better energy production of the body, you tend to feel better. Yeah. I mean, logically that makes sense. I just find that percentage is profound. Yeah. I mean, that's a big difference to report within a week's time. You know, it's cool about this. It's also, it's also good for you. It's extremely safe. So it's healthy. It's good longevity. Easy to take. And it's inexpensive. Yeah. Inexpensive, easy to take. Yeah. Keon, our partners Keon have pure creatine, monohydrate, I think, and capsules, and just powder. You just try it. Yeah. Try it for 30 days and see if you notice an improvement. Well, it seems a lot like the conversation we had about like mitochondrial health and like why that's popping up so much. Yes. Very much connected and that whole energy production system is like, you know, if you can get that back on track, like how many things we could resolve as a result. I have a friend of mine who is a nurse and so she, and she does those creating how nurses sometimes, well, you know, your wife did this, these crazy schedules. Yeah. Whether work overnight or whatever and then try to readjust and it's just brutal. It's brutal. Yeah. Graveyard shifts. She started taking creatine. She's like, I feel way better. Yeah. Like way better. My, my, my mental focus is better. I don't feel so foggy. I don't feel so burnt out. And she's just taking 10 grams a day. Yeah. What was, what was that study that came out about like, you know, the lack of sleep and how it 20 grams. Yes. 20 grams. Yeah. Yeah. We had really bad sleep. 20 grams of creatine erased the cognitive deficits that came from it. Crazy. It was wild. I know. Isn't that cool? No, that's super cool. I love that. Yeah. Anyway, a BPC study. I got a BPC study for you guys. BPC 157. It's back, right? Like in circulation. It looks like they're going to reverse the, they're, they're definitely going to reverse the restrictions. So BPC 157 will be, yeah. So they gave 12 patients. This is a human study. 12 patients, a single injection of, one injection of BPC 157 in their knee. Okay. So these had people had chronic knee pain. This is osteoarthritis, meniscus, tears, ligament, sprains. So people who had just chronic knee pain, one injection, 11 out of 12 of them. So that's majority of them had pain relief, significant pain relief that lasted six months to a year with one shot. Every one of them had failed standard treatment for over a year. That's wild dude. Yeah, dude. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. That's wild. I know. Is it, is it officially back? Do you know if it's back with like a MP hormones and stuff? Do you know they have pentadeca arginate, which is the same thing? Yeah. Just, it's just, I know that they're getting me wonder. I know Phil, I know Phil was on the, on the phone with Katrina. I overheard the conversation and I wanted to say there was five peptides that came back that were, that was one of them. And I'm assuming that that means they've, they've got it ready to go now. I don't know if that was like it's going to, but I know he was celebrating that news with her, which was a big deal. That was, I forgot what the other four were, but there were some other big ones too. So the thing about peptides is that they're so popular now. And you can go online and get them as research chemicals. And this is what a lot of people are doing, is they're going online. They're not getting them from FDA regulated compound pharmacies. A bit of a crapshoot. And, you know, some of them may be good, some of them may not, some of them might be something bad. I've actually seen some third party testing. It's a little scary on some of that stuff. Again, you're injecting your body. You might want to go the FDA compound lab, you know, compounding pharmacy, I should say, um, brow with a doctor. That's what we have at mphormones.com. It's like, this is a real medical professional. And this is, these are real compounding pharmacies. It's not a describe quote unquote research chemical. What percentage of people do you think go gray market? A lot. Really? It's a huge market, bro. Yeah. It's a huge market. So funny to work around. It's always, I mean, even like the sub one, remember as a, like a trainer early on, like with my clients, when I tell them to go get like a certain protein powder or this or that and come back with a Walmart. Yeah. Yeah. What are you doing? Oh, it was half the price. It's like, yeah, it's probably half the shit. Yeah, two, a quarter of it. Like, I, and this is stuff that you're ingesting. This is stuff you're injecting. It's like, why would you risk? It matters. Yeah. This is just one of those things I don't know. Save on your grocery bill or your electric bill or save on something else. I mean, I get saving money. I can respect that, you know, but the thing that you end up ingesting or injecting into your body, probably not the thing you, yeah, I wouldn't skimp out on that. Should roll the dice on. Every time I see this, every time I see an investigative report on supplements, we're not even talking about peptides right now. Okay. Supplements. Every time I see an article, I go, Oh God, here we go. Because they'll take supplements, they'll take third parties, test them all. And like a majority of them come back. Like, not good. Yeah. Yeah. Supplements. Just regular old supplement. You're like, oh, and then you're bummed. You know, it's because it's such an easy cash grab because the nobody checks. If you do, because nobody checks, if you put just whatever in it, you can, you can get away with it and you can sell it for really expensive for and cost you nothing to bill or make. So, you know, if you make a good run for six months to a year before you get caught, it's a slap on the wrist and you made a bunch of money. So, of course, I mean, it's so dirty that there's companies that do this, and they just changed their branding and do it again. No, I'm serious. It's like, that's it. Yeah, it's not, there's not like serious ramifications. It's like a slightly, yeah, exactly. Shreds rebranded, recame came right back and did something else. So these companies do that. They run as long as they can. And they sell, they sell until that somebody decides, somebody else decides to pay for a third party test just to call them out, right? Yeah. And then it's like, oh, you caught us. And then, oh, we'll just start a whole new brand, do it all, do the hustle all over again. And it's just like, dude, I mean, those are the things I don't know that you, you don't go skimp on. I don't feel like spending for the extra. And that's why it's expensive. Why the good supplements are expensive is because they're, they're paying to have all that stuff. They pay them themselves. And margins on supplements, I mean, depending on the supplement, but they're typically not that good, especially the common ones like protein powder, margins suck. Yeah. Creatine sucks. Creatine sucks. Yeah. Because they're super popular. Obviously. All your, all your major vitamins, you know, those are all they suck. There's not, you're not making a lot of, you're not making huge margins off of that. The only way you're making huge margins is if it's garbage in there. If you fill a bunch of, you know, pills with water, then you can make a bunch of money. But if you don't, my favorite, when they take, um, like, uh, you know, like the libido boosting pills and like 80% of them actually have like vagaries. Yeah. Like Viagra in them. It's like one out of every, like 20 pills or something. By the way, you know, it's what it worked. You know, it's funny about that is that that definitely didn't stop anyone from buying them. No. Because that's like, that's like, Hey, did you guys know those muscle building pills, like five out of 10 had steroids? Yeah. Whoa. Let's keep taking them. Oh, that's, that's why they use things like that, like Niacin, like they use supplements and they use pro things, materials that make people feel something. Do you remember the first time you took a big dose of Niacin? Yes. What do you, my eyes off sitting in my bed, bro, I, I read that Niacin was good. Turn my whole face red like a tomato. Dude, I was working. I was managing Santa Teresa and I read some stupid article about Niacin and blood flow and this, that and the other. So I'm like, just cheap dude. I'll buy out. You know, I'll take anything cause I did. I took a big old dose of Niacin bro. 40 minutes later, I'm giving a tour of the gym and I'm just, and the lady's looking at me kind of like funny. She's like, are you okay? And I look in the mirror and it was, it looked like I had a massive sunburn. My whole, everything was super red. So funny. I was like, what just happened? I think you're the only person I've ever met who's actually been able to take like each component from the supplement, buy them all individually, put them together and like, it's, it's funny to me. I love it. Cause it's like, you're like this mad, you know, experimental scientist back in the day and doing all that stuff. You, you for sure have, you win the award on all, although I definitely did a lot of stuff like that. That's, I think why I'm so jaded is cause I did so much stuff that didn't work. And so I'm like, now I'm just like, it takes a lot to convince me that it's worth me spending any money on anything. It's like most stuff is, I mean, I did one of those, I did one of those videos that our social media team did. And I think it was, I think Eli had me rate, it was Eli or Danny had me rate like zero to five for, I think building muscle and I gave supplements at zero. Oh my God. Because of the list you had to pick, where's it? Yeah, we have zero to five food, lifting weight, Yeah. Yeah. It was just like, no, of course. That fall in line. Yeah. It's just the bottom. And then people were like, what about creatine? I'm like, well, creatine's great, but it's not moving the needle like these other things are going to move the needle. I need to go to creatine you want for building muscle, not getting good nights, rest and not work out. You're going to get shit. It's like you're taking a bunch of kindergartners and you're like, who's the strongest kindergartner? That's creatine. Yeah. Of all the supplements, it's the best. We're dealing with supplements here, you guys. Yeah. A lot of them don't do much. That's what you have to understand. And it doesn't mean that I like, well, I thought you said that. I was like, no, I mean, creatine is the greatest supplement. It's amazing. But it's like, if you give me a list of things that it's not, let's put this way, my family member comes to me and they're, Adam, give me the things I need to do to go build muscle right now. And I give them the list. Like it just, it doesn't even, it doesn't crack the top five. I'm not, it's not my. I will say this for some cases, there's certain nutrients. If you have a nutrient deficiency or if you're one of those, Oh, of course. If you're one of those people that you're just not making enough ATP, it's an inexpensive way to see, does this help me? Is this going to help you? Well, that's the new one. Even then you have to get to the point where you're doing all the right things and then something still isn't working. Right. You're like, okay, now I'm going to investigate this. That's the new ones. Or if like you have, I mean, you've got to expend all income then 100% then by all means, you know, what you use and try and do all those things like that. But it's like, you know, I've never had somebody come to me and we weren't building muscle. We were doing something and it was because I didn't give them a supplement. It wasn't something like that. Oh my God, I forgot that. I forgot that. You know who was really fun for me to train with supplements? Doug. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Doug loves supplements. So I would just be like, hey, try this. I'm like, okay. You know why? Cause Doug's like you and where he's, he's good about, he's good about doing all the things. Oh yeah. Yeah. I'm terrible about that. You take the pills. Like it's so hard. Like, you know, I need someone to follow me around and like. I can do one at a time. Like, like I'll just do the one thing. Yeah. I don't take anything. Like none of it, none of it all the once. I don't know. It's just like, just I want to see if this is actually can do something. And I like, I don't care. I should just start feeding. That's what I should do. I should be in, I should be in charge of you guys. The supplements. I mean, I'm good if you, if you give it to me, I mean, that's why I've left it before. That's why I've left it. That's why my thing looks like a mess over here of all these pill bottles. So that's because it's only well take it. Is that look over at you right there? That's accessible. Are you looking at your eyes? Yeah. I look over here and I'm like, oh, I should I get those. I got to go some of it. Sal told me to take you. All right. So I'm going to take a left. So I pulled up some. Have you guys seen that the studies that came out have been coming out on homeschooling? No. You guys see them? Mm-mm. So like new stuff. So they just came out with some testing and some data on homeschool kids. Homeschool kids outperform their public school peers in math, science, history, English, the SAT and the ACT. They basically demolished them. I don't believe it. On all categories. And then I looked up the popularity of homeschooling through the years. In 1970, there were only 13,000 kids that were homeschooled. 1990, 850,000, 2000, 1.5 million, 2020, 5 million. Whoa. It's blowing up. It's bloated. How many? 2020, I bet jumped because of COVID. Of course. A lot of parents were like, OK, I see what's going on here. Watch the Zoom. You're like, I could do that. Yeah. But yeah. And these kids generally outperformed their peers. I was just talking to these kids that were homeschooled over the weekend. And it was interesting because they're talking about their subjects that they study too. And it's like, OK, we're learning Latin. We're learning logic. And I was like, wait a minute. Logic. Like what does that entail? What's the curriculum entail for logic? And it's like, they'll give them these certain problems, but it's like, they have to articulate the entire process of how they got to that conclusion. And I'm just like, wow. Like you would never get that in a public school. What are some of the bias that come with that though? That you have to be fair, right? Because the type of person who decides they're going to take on a responsibility like homeschooling your kid is already a different person. That's right. It's not the average person. This is typically a parent that's very involved. Very. You're right. You have to be. And so there's advantages. Small classroom, although a lot of homeschool kids do pods and stuff like still small classroom. And here's another. This is a big advantage. Like my wife just did this this morning. I just talked to her this morning because she's just going into new curriculum with my five-year-old. And my five-year-old, a good parent, a mom or a dad knows what's most important for their kid to learn. OK, here's an example. My son is doing these exercises where he has to learn how to listen, pay attention, and follow order. So she'll read a paragraph and then he'll have to go and try and remember every step. So we'll say, OK, first thing you're going to do is underline the dog. Then you're going to write A at the top of the page. Then you're going to use a red crayon circle. And so it's like a bunch of steps. When she's done, he has to go through and try and remember everything. So it's an exercise on paying attention. But my wife knows that my son, the thing that he probably, that he definitely needs to work on the most is not being a perfectionist. See, he's got this thing where if he messes up, he beats himself up. He really beats himself up. So she knows that. So when he does it and he does a bunch of things wrong because she's mom and she knows, instead of saying, here's what you did wrong, here's fix that, she's like, oh no, let's move to the next one. Let's try it again. Because she knows him. A teacher might not have this ability because A, you're not mom. Well, yeah, you're not going to get that kind of individualized custom. That's right. Yeah. And you're managing 30 adjustments. That's right. And so she's able to say, hey, this is the most important. In fact, I like that he's learning how to pay attention. But what's really important is I want him to not be a perfectionist because that can cause less. So my theory is tied more to what I said and you admitted, which is what I think is that I think that obviously the parents at home school are far more involved with the kids. And I think that if I can be as involved with my kid with the professional of a teacher like leading the way, it's like this beautiful, like I'll go heads up with a kid getting homeschooled with my son because of the attention that he gets and the leadership that he's getting with school paired with the amount of attention that my wife and I give that kid. Now, take homeschooling kids and put them against all schools. And so with that, like, oh, I wouldn't take that. But I'd take the bed on the homeschool kids all day long. But I would imagine a kid if you if you teased out all the parents that are completely disconnected from their kids schoolwork and involvement and don't say, not a day goes by that Katrina I or both Katrina and I spent at least an hour plus with Max on part of his school stuff. It were our school requires it. We had to sign off that we went through the packet. We did all the things and the kids in kindergarten. Okay. So we're not even into the upper grades. So with and I and they teach them stuff that I'm like, oh, wow, that's so I wouldn't have thought to do that. So I think you're always going to do better when you care. And you pay attention for sure. But the crux of it all. But but that's my point is like, I would I would love to see the comparison if you teased out all the parents that do not are not involved. And then you put homeschool heads up against parents that are involved that are also in it. So where the homeschool kids and there aren't specific studies, but there are studies that move in that direction. And so we don't have a direct one. So it's hard to say. I think that's the biggest factor. I agree with you. I think the biggest factor is how much a parent cares and how much are involved. But what you find with homeschool kids is the odds that they that they follow their parents values are significantly higher across the board. That they yeah. And I think it's like, here's the thing. Like you can be very involved with your kid, but they're still away for six hours being taught by someone else. That's right. And you're rolling the dice on what values that they're giving. Yeah. So if you're homeschooling your kid and you're definitely putting them in things, you're not just like keeping them at home all the time. Most homes that's a myth, right? Let people think homeschool means they're just with me all the time. That's not true. But they're with you way more than than the typical kid who goes off for a long time. I mean, six hours or five hours or seven hours in school. It's interesting when you talk to homeschool parents are really successful at it. Ask them how much time you actually spend on education every day. It's like two hours an hour. Yeah. Like, wait a minute, what? And your kid like went to college and is crushing and how did you get through all that stuff? Yeah. You didn't need to spend six hours doing all that stuff. I always wonder too, like, and I'd be just gonna be great talk to my cousin be great talk to because they both obviously. I think your cousin's the best person to talk to because she's done it for so long. So long. We're so new to it. Yeah. And so many kids. And so many kids. Because the part that and I've never really asked for this that I find is and maybe Max is because he's at a young age. He is when he's in the classroom setting, he's so much more likely to sit down and do the work. Do a thing that when he's with mom and dad, there's it takes more of an effort for him to buy in to doing that. And so there's also the power of you and your peers are all sitting down and there's like and they have a very structure to all that versus me trying to get him to do certain things. It's like working at home remote. Right. It's a very similar aspect because yeah, there are those clear distinctions. It's like, you know, we're okay, but now we're family and we're hanging and we're, you know, to have that kind of clear split. You know, there could be some bleed over. But yeah, I know it's interesting too because it's like if and I feel like the passion has to come through as well. Like if that's, you know, from the parent that's actually, you know, providing it because you can get that kind of passion from a really good invested teacher. Yeah. That actually very knowledgeable, but like pays that kind of attention. That's how I know I couldn't do it. It's just that I know I know I know I could. It is hella work. Yeah. Let's be honest. Let's all be honest straight up. When you have little kids, it's a nice break oftentimes to say, okay, go to school and outsource that. I get some time to myself. I get some time to clean the house. Like if you're, it's like you're on all the time. It's a big ass commitment. I don't think it's for everybody for sure. Yeah. I wouldn't be able to do it. If it was on me, I would definitely, I know. Yeah, we wrestled that. Yeah. As much as I bowed you with it, I wouldn't be able to do it. Yeah. No, I mean, I've said to Katrina before, like, I mean, I mean, I would like for us to do it, but it's like, man, I could, it would be, I couldn't do it. You know what I'm saying? And she wasn't motivated to really want to do that because there is, there's a huge, there's, man, it's a huge, it's a nice to have. That's why it's easy for us to be involved in parents is because I've only got to be involved in an hour after school. You know what I'm saying? Like that's not hard for me. That's not hard for me to pick up with. You're reinforcing it. Yeah, to pick exactly to talk to my teacher, his teacher and go like, where's he going? Where's he doing well? And I mean, we go through all his stuff. It's like where he's, where he's lagging behind or where he's struggling or where he's like selling. And it's like, okay, cool, we can focus on this at home. And then we compliment all their hard work that they're doing. And it's like, okay, I could do that. I got that all day. But ask me to do that for six hours in the day and then transition over to like parenting home and value dad, which is different than school dad, I guess. Like that would be, that would be crazy. Part two is that, and I see this more with public schools and depending on where you're at, but oftentimes like you look at what they teach your kids. Like from a values perspective, and you're like, man, I don't, that's not what I agree with. Like, what are you guys teaching our kids right now? What do you do? I've seen so many stories of parents going to battle with schools over certain things that they're educating their kids on. Yeah, it's weird what people feel compelled, like ideologically, that they have to insert and inject. And you're just like, you know, instead of sticking with the curriculum. And so like it just got, it muddied the waters a lot in the education system that I've found. And so it's, it's been rough, you know, over the last few years needs to be disrupted big time. Well, that's the part that I think right now I'm good. I feel very, very confident in the direction they're going. Like, how will I handle being faced with something like that? Right? Like what, what, what, what will I do? Yeah, we just pull them out. Right? Well, yeah, no, I mean, that's exactly how I'm going to. I talked to some parents, I told you guys this last time that they were in a classroom and one of the kids in the classroom identified as a cat. And everybody went along with it. And they're like, no, we're taking our kid out. What are you guys doing? Yeah, it seems like an urban legend. No, it's real. I've heard of this a couple of different examples of that. Yes. It might even be the same. Same kid probably. Yeah, we're in the same area. Yeah, dude. Like what are you guys doing? Yeah. Oh, we want them to feel comfortable. No, dude, what are you doing? Yeah. Meanwhile, we all get made up. But yeah, it's like what the hell is going on here? Yeah. Yeah. And then you as a parent, you gotta say they're explaining that back home. Well, we have a cat in the classroom. Some people really like Halloween. Yeah. Like, dude, you're round. You said Halloween. You brought up the holidays right now. My poor wife, which she's battling right out. So if I said loves to decorate for the holidays, right? We know you guys have known that forever with Halloween and Christmas. Well, those are the big ones, right? But Katrina, I don't know if you've ever been to our house. We do. She does everything. St. Patrick's Day, Easter. Oh, that's nice. So she does like little decorations to the house. She has a couple of vases that she always changes. And she's got out every holiday through the whole year planned out. But we only go crazy for Christmas and Halloween because those are like month long decorations. But he's learned that, you know, that we do decorate for St. But we put all the stuff out for St. Patrick's Day with the goal and do the whole thing and Easter and yada yada. But he's getting upset at Katrina that we don't have. We don't have enough decorations for Easter. And Katrina's like, this isn't nothing. No. Well, it's an outside holiday. Why would we not have decorations outside? That's his argument right now. He's asking you all the other family. He's the big bunny. For Katrina right now, it's like trying to solve this. I don't know what to do with this kid right now because he wants to decorate. You got Easter and then what? Sink it in my mouth. Well, we got... You know, you guys are so great. You know what he's talking about, bro? It's so racist. That's a hard one. You guys decorate for St. Patrick's Day. Yeah. We had St. Patrick's Day. We just did. We had some services. And then we did the whole... You know, that's what she gets for going over the top and doing the whole house up and making it look like the leprechauns came in and destroyed it and pissed in our toilet and left it. No way, really? Oh, yeah. That's funny. She put prints on the seat. Oh, she goes all out. Oh, yeah. Then turns the toilet water green. Oh, my God. And then writes a note, ha-ha, I got away. And then she steals the gold. That's great. But nobody does that. Like, I told you guys way back, I dressed up as a leprechaun going to school. So that was like, you know, the level we went in my house. You know, that's my favorite story. Because nobody dresses up. I'm just like casually throwing that out there. You're the only one? You're the only one in the entire school. Leprechaun hat, dude. Buckle, like, tights. Sixteen. Dude, I'm in sixth, fourth grade, dude. Maybe third grade, actually. So you showed up, your mom dressed you up like a leprechaun. Yes. Dropped you off at school. Dropped me out. Hey, no, no, I was on the bus. I can't believe my friends didn't just completely roast me, dude. But I mean, you're so young that like everybody was like, oh, hey. Hey, hey, hey, hey. They thought it was cool. You didn't get pinched. That's for sure. I didn't get pinched. You didn't get pinched that day. And that's back when I, you know, I thought I could do this little Irish jig. And so, so you just busted out? I swear to God, like, other teachers pulled me in their class and I just did it. Irish jig in front of the whole school. Look, kids, we have a leprechaun here today. And you'd think, right, like, I wouldn't have this fear of like speaking in public, you know. But hey, how many letters did you get from girls that day? Like, hey, do you like me? Yeah, I don't even remember. I was like looking back. I'm so, it's so embarrassing. Like it's like, whoa, dude, I can't believe. I'm sure I bet if we let Max, he probably would do something like that. To show up by himself. I would not be surprised if we if we got an outfit for him to wear. He'd want to wear it to school. He would probably do that. That's hilarious. Yeah. He's I mean, he loves the dressing up for birthdays. Does he wear because my kids love this. I don't know. Is that too old for this? My kids. He's uniform. Well, no, they love like theme pajamas. Oh, yeah. And so my three year olds convinced whatever she wears, she gets the powers of that. So we got her incredible pajamas. We got spider-man pajamas. And then here's the best one. You guys ready for this? Yeah. Someone gifted us a Christian pajamas that said like Jesus on them. Yeah. So she runs out of a room. It's not a superhero. Just Jesus, right? She runs. I have Jesus powers. I'm like, what? I have the most power. She's start walking on like. I have the most power. So she's like, she's got Jesus power. I'm like, all right. So. So in our house. Quick, you have water? Let me turn out the wine real quick. The luxury of. You're forgiven. You're forgiven. You're forgiven. You're forgiven. Everybody's just starting to do that. That. Wow. The big luxury is if we allow him to stay in pajamas. Because if it was up to him, he'd wear pajamas all day long. So when he goes over to Nana's house, we normally end up picking him up in the afternoon or the next day. And he's still in his pajamas. He's all day long. He was there. Yeah. If he could wear pajamas all day, he'd wear pajamas all day and swim naked. That's his thing. That's like. Wow. And so that's like, hey, we can't always. He is your son, dude. Yeah. He's so, so, so weird. Yeah. How similar he is to you. Yeah. 100% dude, little mini-atom. Dude. That's funny. Hey, you guys, by the way, I gotta tell you guys, do you know who eats all the crisp power? Who's responsible for that? Do we eat them all? Who? We thought it was the trainers. No, it's done. The leprechauns. Listen. The leprechaun hander. We're on to you, Doug. Hey, every time. When we're done with the show. Every time. And sometimes I'll hang out just a little bit. He's got, you got a bag in there, don't you? Not at the moment. I ate all those. What are you, okay, what's your favorite? You just brushed him. What's your favorite? The Flamin ones. I like those. I do like those, too. Those are good. I like them. And everything ones. I like those. I like those, too. Just get everything. And I'll be in here doing something, and I'll hear. I need some of that afternoon protein. You know, a little bit of a pick me up. I mean, maybe the protein is. Maybe the greatest hack yet, though, when you think about it. What other, what other carb snack has got that much protein? Well, it's not that high in carbs, to be honest. It's not. It's got fiber. You know what I mean? Hey, look it up, Doug. Yeah, yeah. Fiber's got fiber. You know what I mean? Fiber's got fiber. Carb-based. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's a, it's a carb-based snack. I mean, the pretzels. Yeah, what would you call pretzels otherwise? Yeah, yeah. You would consider it that. So that's, that's my point. Like what, what other carb type of snack that is high protein, low carb, like that you. I can't think of any. Let me think. Beef jerky, dried chips, like they do? Oh, yeah. Like the chip. How much fiber's in that? Like pork rinds or something. So 10 grams of fiber. Yeah, bro. Hey, listen, 28 grams of protein, 10 grams of fiber. I know. It's so good. Yeah. Only, yeah, it's so good. Low calorie. Yeah. So good. Yeah. Yeah, they do a good job. That, hey, by the way, that company, it's already blown up. Oh, it's huge. That's going to be. They're already, I think they, are they in Costco now? I thought I saw they were in Costco Target. I did see it somewhere that, I think it was Costco, yeah. Yeah, Costco, Wegmans, Hivee, the vitamin shop. They, they, What's Hivee? They blew up fast. Not in this local area, but I'm sure some place says. Yeah, they, they blew up fast. I'm telling you guys right now, he'll cry, he cries, every day he has a bag over there. I have a bag almost every day. Do you really? Yeah, no, it's such a great easy snack. It's high protein. Yeah. When can you eat, like I said, when can you eat a salty, chippy like snack and get 20 something grams? I know other brands have come out with like protein chips, but they're not as high of protein as that. Yeah. They're not as high of, It's weird. And they're nowhere near as good either. Yeah. How it like tastes like that. And it's like light and crunchy. You know what I saw a video just made me think of? Have you guys ever done this? Maybe Justin, you have. You did the most construction and you guys eat the most. Did you do the most? Seven and a half. Did you do the most construction? You did more than us. I did a lot, but yeah. Yeah, I brought you to a lot more than us. Pretty much like every job I had until college, I started waiting tables. I did, I did it for, I did it when I was like a teenager in the summers with my dad. Yeah, that's, I did for a few years like that. But I saw a guy on social, is this a thing where you buy a bag of chips? Then you open the bag and then you go to like 7-Eleven and you put the nacho cheese in the bag. Oh, that's high school shit, dude. Kids have been to high school for a long time. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Kids, you know, they do, they get nacho cheese in there. They get fire cheetos and pour the nacho cheese over the top of it and they eat out of the bag. Oh, and we do a lot more slurpy, like, like we, you'd mix all the different slurpees together. Yeah, that's our era. Our era is 7-Eleven, mix three or four slurpees. The next generation coming up in high school, that was like a thing where you get fire, when fire cheetos, remember when fire cheetos became popular? We were already kind of on our way out of high school. What's in a slurpee that keeps it not, because I've had icees or shaved ice, it's not the same as a slurpee. No, so shaved ice is an actual ice machine that's like... Yes, I know that. But what's a slurpee because it's still ice, right? Yeah, I don't know. They use chemicals mixed, though, so... Yeah, it's kind of like when you get a, what is it, like a frozen drink at a bar? Yeah. They have a thing that keeps spinning. It's like a margarita. But it stays like that for a while. Yeah, well, it's because it's moving. It doesn't let it freeze. It stays really, really cold. Yeah, but I bet you icy. Look at the heat. They keep it kind of liquidy by moving it. No, it's just a syrup. Is this syrup over ice? Oh, yeah, just a syrup over ice. Because you know what they do is sometimes, like the ice cream, the soft syrup, there's chemicals in there. Yeah, who knows? They probably have that, bro. I mean, it's 7-11. Yeah, I guess you're right. Yeah, so you get some syrup. It's also surprising. That's all it is. Oh, well, there you go. They use yucca and quila... What is that? Quila? Quila extracts for foam stability. Let's see, that's what it is. See, something makes it stable. Yucca and quila. I thought it just keeps it moving. Quila. And that's what keeps it from freezing. And it's kept at a very cold temperature inside there. What plant does those come from? Yeah. What plant? Well, the yucca plant is a plant. That is a real plant. Were you on big ones? So we used to have one plant. I was a big slurpy kid. Really? Yeah, yeah. 7-11 was right by my house, and we used to do that. Do what Justin said. Yeah, we'd ride our bikes over there, and we'd do the... I was weird. And I wasn't like, I would eat it. I mean, you gave me a slurpy. I'd have a slurpy suicides. You were too busy reading the encyclopedia. Yeah, no, no. I liked weird snacks. I liked Cheetos, cheese puffs. I liked the Ritos. You liked the circus peanuts. You know what I liked that was weird? That nobody liked... I don't think anybody would eat, but I loved was Funyuns. I used to crush Funyuns. I loved Funyuns. You know why I stopped eating them, though? Make your breath smell. Yep. So you're in junior high, and you're trying to talk to a girl, and you just had fun. I hate those that hate corn nuts. Love corn nuts. The one kid that would always come with corn nuts, the whole room stank, dude. They're delicious. Me at least. I like... You don't like corn nuts, huh? I just... I love them. There's something satisfying about the crunch of those, too. I'm outnumbered here. Where were you reading the class? Someone needs to make high protein corn nuts. You really got a good brain cheese on cracker, dude. Yeah. Okay. Cheese whiz. I was a cheese whiz. He's a big cheese whiz guy. I would always bring... And everybody tried to steal my string cheese, dude. Straighten that. Hey, there's a little trauma back there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was a little trauma there. I would come with two, and then it would always be one. I'm like, who stole my string cheese? I think it was a joke amongst my other friends. Somebody would always try and steal my string cheese. Did you bite the string cheese or peel it? I peel it, dude. What's the point of the string cheese? I know. Did you guys have braces as kids? No, I did. I never did. Either one of you. It's funny about that. Did you do? No. My parents asked me... The only one. They didn't invent braces back then. Yeah. I had a crooked teeth and all that, and they're like, do you want to fix that? I'm like, well, I don't know. I think I'm... I was just trying to be like, well, I'm cool. I'll deal with it kind of thing. Oh, good. Great. Great. Fine. I just saved them a ton of money. That's really what it mounted to. It's really pricey now. Like, why would you ask a kid? I mean, it was pricey when we were kids, but it's like gone crazy. I think it generally around $7,000. No, yeah. It was like a thousand something when we were kids. My daughter had to have... She had a lot of stuff happen. We did the pallet spreading, like the whole meal. But they don't do headgear anymore, I think. I haven't seen headgear anymore. Not so much anymore now. I haven't seen it, but... No. No. They're better. They do something else, but headgear was broke. Remember the kid? Hey, I got headgear. It was rough. So I got the lowdown on ICs here for you. So we got flavored syrup, water, CO2, and a specialized pressurized machine. So the machine continuously churns and freezes the liquid to create a fluffy carbonated semi-solid. Slippery. It's the CO2 and the moving of it. That's what it is. Can you do like a nitro-infused version of that? You may be able to, Justin. I mean, that's what... That's kind of what it is, right? I think that's kind of what it is. Okay. Yeah. I like chicken. Coffee, icy sounds kind of good, actually. Isn't you're saying that? Chicken and a biscuit crackers for me. Hold that thought, dude. Best. Nobody eats those, dude. Chicken and a biscuit? I don't even think they make anything. Yes, they're still around. Those were the best, bro. Crackers that taste like chicken soup. That's also one of those things. It's weird. It's like, was it ramen that was like shrimp flavor? And you're like, hmm. Oh. Why is it... Yeah, like, how... Did you eat dry ramen? Did you ever eat dry ramen and pour the stuff on it? I probably in college, yeah. I get a lot of like, what is that, that cheese that comes out of the can? Cheese whiz. Cheese, yeah. That's easy cheese. Yeah. Oh, easy cheese. Probiotics have been shown to improve gut health, reduce inflammation, help with the look and health of your skin, help with anxiety, depression, speed up recovery. There's almost nothing a probiotic hasn't been shown to improve because it's your gut health. You got so much bacteria in there that you live with that creates things like chemicals your brain needs, help reduce inflammation, all that wonderful stuff. Well, look, you're probably wondering what's the best probiotic out there? Seed. Seed is the world's best. Go check them out. Go to seed.com forward slash mind pump. Use the code 20mindpump. Get a discount. Back to the show. Our next caller is Jennifer from Tennessee. Hi Jennifer. Hello. Hi Jennifer. Hey, hey, hey. Thanks for having me on. You got it. How can we help you? So first of all, I know this is total first world problems and totally insane vanity, but I've heard you guys address a few things that are similar to what I have going on, but nothing exactly like me. I have been following your show for a while. I have a couple of your programs. I would be what I guess considered pear shape. So I show, sorry dog. It's very easy for me to show all sorts of muscles in my upper half, but I cannot get definition in my lower half to save my ever living life. A little bit of backstory. I've worked out since I'm a little hyper, a lot hyper. So exercise was like a way to medicate myself throughout my entire, like whatever, junior high, high school and adult life. And I did it the 90s way, right, which is the cardio. And I swam through high school and then I did rowing. So it was, there was some lifting involved, but I'm very strong naturally. And that's not, that hasn't been cool. And except for maybe the last five years. So I hid from that, right? I was like, give me the five and 10 pounds because that's what girls are supposed to do. Last five years, I've been really up in the lifting. I don't know what my maxes are because I'm afraid to max out. But with you guys following your maps, anabolic last fall and now I'm on muscle mommy. I've been just, every time I lift, I'm just trying to add a couple pounds. So how does somebody who has a pretty good background in exercise? I used to own a yoga and Pilates studio here in town. I did a lot of that. I still do a little bit of Pilates. I have a reformer and chair and stuff here at home, not too much. I'm following muscle, muscle, muscle mommy phase two right now. 15 of like those reps can be exhausting. You all love the shoulder work. I've noticed that. But how do I modify it? I heard you guys talk about this with one fella because he had big legs. We, he reduced the volume on the legs and increased it on the upper body. How do you modify your programs to do, is it more volume on the legs to get definition? It's not, it's not to get more definition, but to build more muscle. So there's a couple of ways that you can get more definition in an area. One is to get it leaner and one is to develop the muscle underneath more. Now you look like you're pretty lean just from looking at you. What's your body percentage? The Hume scale, y'all are not going to like it. It's at 17 percent, 17.3. I would, I would have guessed by just looking at you. I could tell that you're in the teens. I don't think it's a good idea to try to get leaner. I don't want to. Yeah, you won't feel good. It'll throw your hormones off. It's just not good. Probably what you want to do is just focus on building the lower body a little more to get the shape that you're looking for. And the way to do that is to take volume away from upper body training and transfer it to lower body training. The other option is this, and this very well may be the case. You might be just a little bit skewed on how you're judging the way you look. Yes, the Hume scale has helped a lot with that. It was a Christmas present to myself. And when I saw the body fat percentages and different various body parts, I was like, oh, that's shocking. The Hume scale has helped some of that body dysmorphia for sure. However, when you're sitting there and if I take my sweater off and you can see all the muscles and there's veins showing if I lift anything, which dudes think is cool. It's not so cool. I don't have any of that in the legs. Not that I want to have the veins showing, but I would like there to be evidence of the fact that I exercise like when I wear shorts and you don't see that necessarily. I'm going to bet, I would bet my house that you're, that you look very developed and muscular in the lower body. If you have veins in the upper body, you get leaner. It's going to get worse. I don't want to get, I've been bulking because of you guys. I've been bulking since January. I've been bulking since January. I don't follow. I used to coach for an Indian company and they were really big on the macros and all that kind of stuff. And it was, it was too low for me. I know very well, if I get below 2000 calories, I will eat you. So I eat between 2500 and 3000 calories a day. It just depends on my daughter makes cookies. We're really clean eaters. We, you know, I've got 20, 37 like meat chickens in my basement right now. So we, we put your own stuff. So we're really clean eaters and I eat a lot. So it's hard for me to, I don't know exactly how much more to add. If you get that. What, what, what, what about, um, tell me a little bit about your, your squat, your deadlift when you do train legs, like what are you working out with? So I, again, so in my, in my email, I have a tear in my right labrum on my hip and my left shoulder labrum. So I'm a little scared of lifting heavy. I went to a PT when I started maps and had her watch me. So I basically started at zero back in November, excuse me, November. And now, you know, with the maps, anabolic, I guess I got up to like 85 and I just kind of got scared with the squat with the deadlifts. I just did the Romanians today. We did 15 at what, like 115 or something. Jennifer, I don't, not that I need to know the answer to that. I said, I already know what's happening here, but how tall are you and what's your body weight? I am five, six and three quarters, the three quarters count. And I weigh about, I oscillate between 150 and 155 right now. So you're 155, 17% body fat. You've had two injuries. I see you did CrossFit. I see you owned a Pilates studio. You're a big fan of the Pilates. I see you owned a Pilates studio. You're on maybe Doug scroll down a little bit for me. You're taking, you're on bioidentical hormone replacement therapy. You're taking Tessa Marilyn, Ipa Marilyn, NAD, glutathione, BPC, TB 500, micro dosing, GLP1. I'm going to tell you something right now. I know what the issue is. What is the issue? You're seeing yourself very skewed, honey. There is no answer to this other than stop focusing so much on the details that you think are not looking the way you want. And that might not be the answer you want, but that's the right answer. Because it, okay, you've got a lot of muscle. You're lean, you're leaner than probably is good. I think you probably should gain some body fat, but that sounds probably like nails on a chalkboard to someone like you. You're eating a lot. You eat healthy. You eat high protein. I, that's, there's nothing you would do more. The only thing I would do, like if I was your trainer, I would focus on correctional exercise. So that you felt more comfortable with heavier movements. Maybe build your confidence in the, in the, in the lifting of your support system. Split stance exercises would be good. Hip thrusts would be good for you. Trap bar deadlifts might be better than a straight bar deadlift for you. Stick with unilateral for a while. Yeah. Unilateral. So like map symmetry, you probably be good for you, but. That was going to be what I thought next. Yeah. That would be good for you. But there's nothing like, there's, I bet you if you sent this picture, it's not that you need to, but I bet you I would probably laugh and be like, I think you're just. Pretty hard yourself. Yeah. You're really hard on yourself. I bet your husband tells you that and your friends probably tell you that too. I, uh, no, he, my husband doesn't care. He said my butt was shrinking since doing a map, Santa Bala. He's like, stop it doesn't even, because I'm whatever, uh, hourglass, whatever, or pear shape. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think you're, I think you're really tearing yourself down, huh? I mean, I could, I mean, yeah, you could add more volume to lower body, reduce volume, upper body, uh, continue to eat. What does that, what does that look like though? When you say reduce volume, like in the maps program, same exercises. So like, like you're falling muscle mommy, right? You would take one or two sets away from the upper body stuff and then add them to the lower body stuff and you don't need to change the programming. So probably something like chest and shoulders since you recognize that that's an area that you, you're not as focused on. So take, you know, two sets from chest, two sets from shoulders, four sets to lower body stuff. And then you have four sets towards a lower body exercise. So just add in another lower body to the maps. Another set. Just another set. You can choose same exercises, just add an extra set. Yeah. So let's say like it says hip thrust for three sets. Now you can do five sets because you took two away from upper body, right? Yeah. Okay. Okay. I haven't done five. I usually stop at three, sometimes four because I was whatever, 90s girl. Yeah. No. So that's it. So you would just trade volume is what you're doing. You can even skip, you know, if you, if your shoulders get really developed in upper body, you could even train them every other week and not have to train them weekly and take that extra work and put it towards the sets on your lower body. Yep. Okay. I'll try it. Yeah. Give it a shot, but I know that's not what you want to hear. I kind of figured that because you guys always harp on women shouldn't get below 20. And I, I've been up when I was having babies. I didn't focus on, I just ate, you know, I was making a kidney. So if mama wants golden grams, mom's eating golden grams. And so, you know, I've gotten above it, but even after, and I weight whatever, I gained like a hundred pounds between both my babies. And so I feel like there's a healthy relationship with food. That's not the issue. I just don't, I don't, I can tell a difference when I'm over 20, I got the pouch. And instead of seeing muscles, you see the parade weight. You know what I mean? I'm not too worried about your body fat percentage because of how much food you said you're eating. You may be one of those athletically, you know, genetically gifted women, which it sounds like you are, where you probably were always stronger. You probably built muscle easier than most people around you. And some women can eat a lot and weight train and walk around, you know, 18% body fat and not really have hormone issues or anything like that. It's not common. But if you were telling me that you were eating, you know, 1800 calories a day, I'd be like, you got to bump, you got to bump that up. But it sounds to me like if what you're telling me is true, which I think it is, that you're eating like plenty of food. I'm not worried about that. But I definitely think that you're breaking yourself down. Like you're probably looking at yourself in the mirror and finding the little areas that you think need to look different. And that's messing up this whole experience. It's just so major to be so major to be so major to be so major to be so major to be major to be major to be major to be major to be major to be major to be major to be major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major major total first world problem, but if I'm working out and following your protocol the three days a week, I'm not doing more. I get my 10,000 plus steps a day because I am hyper. Like I would like to see evidence, especially every woman's going to be like that. You're always going to be harder to see. Like just get a woman to see straightions or quad definition, the lower body is like you're really lean. Yeah. You know, that's just the way it is. Yeah. But I bet you if you were standing with shorts on, I bet we would see very clearly from the front. Oh, there's your quads. You probably have a nice hamstring bump in the back. Yeah, you do. We're just like a win with you. Get your husband on here. I mean, it's Jennifer, it's really easy math for us. Like when you take somebody who's 17 to 19% body fat, that's why I saw asked you how much you weighed is you got a lot of lean body mass. Quickly. And then you're also saying how lean you're if you're showing veins in your upper body, you've got a lot of muscle in your legs. You've got a lot of muscle in your legs. And that it's just and you may not see it that way or think that way. And everybody carries a lot of body fat in their lower legs. Some more than others, but that's especially women. I don't see I don't see quad separation till I'm getting ready for stage. I mean, I just I don't. There's shape to it, you know, and it's and it's covered with body fat. I know it is. That's where most people carry a lot of their body fat is hips and legs and especially women, but you've got a lot of muscle on your body and you're lean. I mean, you're really lean. So going down just to see separation in the legs would require us to hit an unhealthy place of body fat percentage. Yeah, you have to get down 15%. Yeah. Yeah. You don't want to you don't want to do that. You're already on the leaner side. So you're better off just keep focusing on trying to build and place a little emphasis on the lower body. If that's really again, if that's really tough up and get strong and feel comfortable and confident that you can lift a little bit heavier and that's going to help move the needle in that direction you want. Anyways, let me encourage you, Jennifer, you've been doing this for a while. You're you're in the same age range as us. I can see that you're healthy. You've got a lot of energy. If I put you next to women your age, there's probably a dramatic difference in both energy function and the way you look. You're being real hard on yourself. You're crushing it. Yeah. You're you're eating a lot. You got a fast metabolism. You're working out. You're active. Like you're totally killing it. And there's definitely a thing that there's a for real. There's a thing for us as people ruining the experience of this amazing thing that you've accomplished and continue to accomplish by breaking themselves down in the mirror by looking and saying I want this little piece here and I want a little bit more of that. And I feel like I don't look like I work out even though everyone around you is like, man, you look like you work out. Not that it matters what they think. What matters is what you think and it'll ruin the experience for you because you're on your path. If you you stay the course, man, you're you're on this incredible path and you're going to continue to separate yourself from your peers, which you're already already. Like I said, you know this, you go walk around a bunch of women your age and it's very different. You know how that's going to be when you're yeah, you wait till you're 57, 67, 77. It's going to be like you're in a different universe. You're doing such a good job. And I don't think you're celebrating it the way that you should. And so that changes the experience of the whole thing. And it makes it less enjoyable and more stressful. I mean, we're in the long game now at this point, it's like maintain this and continue this on like Sal saying, getting obsessed with it or forcing your body to go a certain direction. This is where the injury comes. This is where the injury happens or the setbacks come. Like you're you're in such a good place, such a great place. Stay there, Jennifer. Thanks. I will try the changing the question I didn't know changing adding some more volume. I'm not going to I don't I don't want to lose weight. I've given up like 151 55 is good 160. I don't even care. But I would just like to I went if a bad guy's coming down the road and I've got my kids with me, I want him to be afraid that I kick him. I kick him into next week. You know what I mean? Just get a gun. We're in Tennessee. We have those two. Yeah, you're doing great. You're doing really good. We'll have a Doug send over map symmetry. So you got that next to fall. I think that'll be good program for you. That's the one that's left and right, right? The bilateral. Yep. Yeah. Unilateral. Yeah. Yeah. Stay in those few phases. Yeah, totally. Don't do the last phase. Don't do the last phase. Okay. And that will help me to get the confidence and the squat. Yes. Yes. Yes, it will. Especially with the injuries that you've had. It'll build up that support system for you. Yep. Awesome. Thank you guys. I appreciate your time. Thank you, Jennifer. You'll have a good one. She did. Did she hear anything? I wish we had a picture so we could see but I mean, obviously, I don't need to see a picture. Yeah, I could see her neck. I could see how her delts look through her sweater. I mean, her numbers are on point. The numbers that she's giving me. She's actually like, she's jacked. Yeah, dude. She's not just like kind of fit. She's like got a really fit. Yeah, really fit. You're not 17% body fat, 150, 160 pounds at her height. Yeah. And and then complaining about your vascularity and your upper body and not have like. It's one. Listen, it's this is tough. It's really tough because and she don't want to hear it. You know, and she don't want to hear it because she probably hears people tell her all the time how great she looks and she's like, no, I don't. It ruins this incredible experience. Not that you got to sit there and celebrate how great you are, but it's like you can't enjoy it. Not only that Sal, but the myth that a lot of people fall for. They don't know until they ever reach that point that it's like the money thing. I'll be happy when I make this much money. I'll be happy when I get to the it's an illusion. And then you get there and you pick yourself apart the same way. It's literally the thing that motivates 90% of these competitors is that they're, they still obsess even after they get present the most perfect physique on stage. They are continually focused on all the flaws and that's what they keep. It's like, it's like, it's 10 years later. She looks back at the picture. Oh my God. I wish I was like this. Exactly what I was going to say. She's going to look at herself in 10 years, look at pictures like, man, I looked, what was, what was I thinking? Yeah. Our next caller is Roger from California. What's up Roger? What's happening? How's it going gentlemen? Thanks for having me. Good. How can we help you man? So I emailed. I've got a probably a pretty unique situation here. So my son and I, right around that Christmas, we purchased the maps 15 power lift. So a little background on my son. He's a baseball player. He's eighth grade going into his freshman year in high school next year. He's pretty kind of small by nature. He just hasn't hit that puberty yet. So he's about five, five, 110 pounds after a good meal. And so we started doing this in an effort to kind of lift more, but not kind of over train with baseball practices and kind of the other things he's got going on. So we got about three weeks into the program. He was, we're in kind of like the deadlift phase, I guess, is looking back on it. And his deadlift was up. He's deadlifting about 230 at the time at increased strength by 10%. I saw all my lifts go, go kind of up in ways I hadn't seen before. So we kind of knew the program was, was really working for us and for him. And it was cool doing it with him as a dad and a son kind of side by side. So the story takes a weird turn here is he was out of baseball practice one morning. And during the drill, it wasn't during batting practice, so he didn't have a helmet on, but a ball that essentially wasn't supposed to be thrown ended up going in his way, hit him in the side of the head. And by that was at 10 in the morning by four o'clock that afternoon, we're in emergency kind of brain surgery at a, what was called a cranial hematoma. So it wasn't actually his brain bleeding, but it was a small artery that was punctured by the fracture. So four hour surgery came out of it. Everything was good. But he's obviously was this was about two and a half months ago. So obviously has some healing to kind of go through, which, which puts the lifting and all of that obviously on, on the back burner. So I kind of at the point we're at now. The reason I had reached out to you guys is I had a good friend at our church. Oh, that's funny. He's a good friend now at the time I did not know the gentleman and he had came over and just randomly started talking, mentioned your podcast, which is where kind of all this kind of comes together. And so after watching my son kind of go through the workout stage and all that working and now kind of hit a, hit a little bump in the road. I kind of wanted to reach out to you guys and just get a feel for kind of he's now so now we're looking about three months before high school preseason kind of camp starts and kind of reaching out to you guys to see what kind of program you would recommend him getting into. Full clearance from the doctors now. I'm just we always say praise to God because brain is 100% healthy. There's zero lingering side effects. Nothing wrong with muscles or anything like that. He's got a full clearance from the doctor. The only thing we're waiting for now for getting back to actually baseball is for the fracture itself to heal and then they had to take out a size of about the his palm from his skull to let the bleeding kind of dissipate. And so now we got away for that kind of to heal up. So he's about a month away from actually getting back on the field. But in terms of the weights and conditioning and all that he's got a full green light to go. So I would just like to kind of reach out to you guys and say you know what would be your advice to him both for getting stronger getting back into it but also just the baseball atmosphere or landscape does look for kids to be bigger and stronger. And so what he could do to kind of fight this little little by nature syndrome that he's got going right now. Yeah man well that's scary dude. So glad to hear he's okay. So again just to confirm no movement issues no speech issues no nothing it's all good. Just waiting for the complete healing. Okay. That was the crazy thing is he had passed all PT and concussion test two days after it. So wow that's awesome man. Thank God protected in a mighty way. That's awesome. So okay so just to encourage you Roger he'll he'll gain back very quickly. The only way to mess this up is to go too hard too fast. Okay. So muscle muscle memory is radically effective and amazing especially in kids. It's wild how kids can build back strength and mobility and function from having a cast on for six months or something like that. It's crazy. So it's just remarkable. The only thing you can do wrong is push too fast. So when he's cleared you go map starter after map starter he'll probably be okay to get back into what he was doing. Map starter is going to feel easy. It's going to feel easy to him or whatever and we're just good. We're just we just want to just be be careful back is stability build back stability strength and it'll come back real quick dude. And then as far as like size and strength it's the same thing we tell everybody make sure he eats enough eats high protein with a kid his age sleep is always a big challenge because they want to stay up on their on their devices or whatever. So it's like now go to bed at the same time wake up at the same time every day don't do the thing where you go to bed super late Friday and you sleep in super late Saturday and you know jet lag yourself on Monday type of deal and that's pretty much it dude there's really nothing nothing crazy crazy advice considering his his his healing is just uh yeah I'm honestly like there's two kind of levers to pull with this and there's intensity and there's volume and I would lean more towards the volume uh in the practice of the lifts uh mainly because that intracranial pressure and just that intensity of him like squeezing and in his output I would be a little bit concerned with that just you know to be on the cautious side and have him really kind of you know work through these movements get that muscle contracting again uh and just kind of be in his body again for a bit uh so to starter and then maybe even like moving into 15 yeah yeah exactly yeah I'd go starter and then 15 after that he'll be fine though by time he gets to 15 because that starters long enough that he's in intensity wise he should be okay and then just really prioritize kids probably the hardest thing I think for young kids is the diet is consistently hitting protein you know and like I'm okay with uh you know some some junk calories or bad calories so long as we hit our protein first and so that would be kind of the message I would be constantly drilling in is you know I really focus on his food yeah I'm not I'm not worried about eating you know extra stuff here and there because he's probably gonna be burning a lot with everything he's doing but what they tend to do is not hit protein and then over consume on sugar and other shit like that that's just not gonna help them build and so keeping him consistent with that uh with all the stuff he's doing lifting wise and training like he'll build muscle but that that's the part that they struggle they struggle with consistently hitting their protein intake the game changer with teenagers is breakfast yes okay yeah that's the that's the big hack dude it's like yeah you get you get him to eat it up that protein yeah you get him to eat like 30 40 grams of protein you know his highs for for breakfast the rest is easy he misses breakfast or skips breakfast or rushes out to go to school then it's a and it's a it's a it's uphill battle the breakfast is the key yeah new nutrition's been the big thing he's not a well say he's not a big eater always he's he's the one I have to remind to eat and uh so yeah what would you guys say if if I was to give him a number calorie wise I wouldn't focus on the calories I'd focus on the protein yeah haven't hit 100 120 grams approaching a day yeah had him hit the hit the protein and then let him eat whatever he wants on top of that so it's like I don't I don't give a shit if he's having ice cream here in there I don't care about the burgers and the fries but hit his protein and take first and the guys are right like what will what will make it really difficult if he's a breakfast skipper or a bowl of cereal guy in the morning and he goes off because that's just a bunch of carbs and sugar and he's not getting high protein yeah the quick breakfast stuff is yeah do you wake up with him and take him to school in the morning or is that mom who does that with him uh yeah so we home school so I'm usually already out of the house um so which makes the sleep part easy because uh they kind of can work on their own schedule so he's good about getting his you know eight to ten hours of sleep yeah okay so this is good so cook breakfast and it's good family time too well even if you don't cook I don't even hear me give the advice all time I love the cook a big dinner and then that breakfast is literally the leftovers with the two three eggs cracked cracked over it like that's okay that's a go to move like I'm sure like you guys I mean most people are consistent with like the dinner time family dinner cooking or what are like that and if you have you know ground beef steak chicken whatever it is and rice sweet potatoes regular potato just literally portion that out for the morning reheat that and throw two or three eggs on top of it and you got yourself a 50 gram you know high protein great breakfast for him starting that him off on the the right track like that makes the rest of the day pretty easy okay awesome that's um I mean I'll share this with him because I know he needs to hear from somebody other than dad he's probably heard the message from dad a little too often so of course and a good target for him is like 150 pounds or 150 grams of protein is a good target if he falls a little misses that he's good yeah shooting for 150 if he's shooting for 150 and he falls short to 110 he'll be 120 he'll be fine yep but shoot for 150 grams of protein will be a good target for him to go after totally okay great thank you cool you got it man thanks for calling in I'm gonna send you a starter okay thank you guys so thank you guys so much for what you do we uh love listening to you guys and uh it's uh it's just great to be able to talk to your face to face and and to share this with my son and it's been a big uh kind of whirlwind of a last two months so I bet yeah I have a cool step uh and just getting better well love I love to hear back after you guys go through this whole process so let's uh let's hear if he sticks with it email back in so we know how he's doing awesome all right Roger thanks man thank you right on oh that's scary dude that hits me a bit oh boy that's scary but thank I mean full recovery like that's wonderful but that is terrifying yeah but yeah with kids it's breakfast oh yeah yeah it's like they don't want to eat the morning I mean shit that's everybody but you're right kids kids especially yeah they don't want to eat skip or you have cereal yeah dude what we do at home now we have a little bit of an advantage because we also homeschool so we're not like rushed because that's what it gets real tough and most schools start so damn early I know they get your kid up and then get anybody eat it's like I don't want to eat right but I do that every day but with our with the little one because my daughter's hard so she's 16 she goes to high school and so we've just what I've done with her is I've gotten her the high protein yogurts and she'll throw granola in there and it's like a compromise right but at least she's getting the protein but it's not a bad compromise though that's a solid you get those ones with 15 20 grams in it I get the 20 the 20 the 30 gram one yeah now it's in it's definitely better than nothing and think on my daughter's like she's playing sports so she's all about it but like with the little ones breakfast is family time and so it's like we got the break we don't have to rush it we're gonna sit together if I'm not there because I'm at work my wife does it with them and you know we they we make sure they get it but that's the hack because you skip breakfast you're trying to get you know you're trying to get 120 grams of protein real difficult which doesn't sound like a ton but if you miss his breakfast now you got what you have 60 grams for lunch and dinner let's be honest school lunch type settings is like a sandwich it's not available it's like 10 grams of protein yeah yeah our next caller is Evan from Indiana what's up Evan it's happening hey how's it going good dude how you doing doing all right um I'll just get into my question then uh so I've got like a lingering question about nutrition I have been vegan for six years and my question mainly is around like nutrition regarding protein um I guess specifically what I understand to be like complete and incomplete like protein sources from plant-based foods so um you know for reference I'll try to hit 210 grams of protein per day and I'm pretty consistent with that it's not too big a deal but while I'm tracking that you know for example if I eat bowl of rice and beans and then protein on top of that the rice and the beans have protein in it that counts towards the total that kind of thing and so my question is like you know how much does it matter that the protein source that I'm eating has is like a complete protein or not um to hit that target good question dude yeah I have some more questions for you uh do you supplement do you take any supplements I take protein powder um to help out with that usually like one in the morning um some of the foods that I make will have like protein powder included in them both to complement the amino acid profile but also just bump the protein of whatever I'm making um aside from that I'll take creatine um and then just vitamins and stuff what kind of vitamins are you taking uh multi b12 uh omega 3 ea's um I think so a little bit I think it has dha and uh the other one okay good good good so so and you said you're hitting about 210 grams of total protein a day and how much you weigh uh right now I'm about 192 okay so so protein quality matters more when you're low when the protein is below a certain threshold uh you're probably beyond that threshold so you're okay in other words the total amino acids you're consuming are okay now you could try getting up to 230 240 grams of protein to see if you notice a difference but if the protein is high then what we start to see with protein quality is it doesn't make that big of a difference anymore now if your protein is like 150 then it definitely makes a difference the only uh caveat is sometimes really high intake of uh vegan proteins because they tend to come along with fiber and other things uh and just quantity is sometimes people see gastric distress but if your digestion is okay uh then you're probably okay um and you could try bumping it to see if you notice a difference and what you'll notice is like more strength better recovery type of deal um but I do have some other questions around diet if that's okay sure yeah so uh what is your what's the reason for going vegan is this uh a moral thing for you like because you don't want animals to be hurt type of deal or yeah basically okay that's good that's fine uh totally fine if you were doing it for health if you're like hey I want to do for health or whatever then we would talk a little bit about the value of eating meat um so so meat is off the table for you or what about eggs are eggs off the table uh off the table strictly vegan okay we're fine then you could bump your protein um and I would I don't know how many grams of creatine do you take a day uh five I was taking 10 um but when I did that in one dose I noticed it hurt my stomach so I bumped it down to five no no just break it up throughout the day I would take 15 grams of creatine a day but I take five threes uh with breakfast five with lunch five with dinner cognitive benefits yeah my vegan clients got remarkable benefits from taking 10 to 15 grams of creatine but you got to divide it up all at once and you'll get gastric distress okay people but he's if you're if you're hitting that that number with eaas you're gonna be he's gonna be fine yeah yeah yeah so if you don't if you're not consistently taking eaas consistently take eaas with uh your meals you could try that and that'll help yeah some capsules like kion makes a really good essential amino acid supplement that's also vegan and what you would do is you would add like five capsules per meal which essentially boosts the what they would label as the protein uh you know quality uh essentially um and you could try that as well I've had you know clients do that who are vegan who also got uh good results from that what are your total calories at right now I'm sitting around 3400 wow oh yeah you're doing good dude you're doing all right and how's your strength training uh it's going pretty good I've been doing the um 15 advanced just starting another round of that after taking a week off okay perfect after finishing the last and it's been going great I think it started I've tracked on and off just because of consistency in life and all that stuff um for the past few years and it started I think around 2700 just because that's been a starting point for me in the past and I went to 3100 and then been sitting at 3400 for I don't know probably good job weeks now that's great and then you get you get things like iron tested uh just just yeah yeah blood works all good beautiful and then with your b vitamins something you might want to try or methylated b vitamins okay some sometimes people in general do better with the methylated version it's a brand that carries it uh I mean I don't know a good brand I mean you could just look it up you just look up methylated b you know complex um I had a vegan client once where we were she kind of had low energy but everything else looked good couldn't really figure it out she was taking b vitamins we switched to methylated b it was like a light switch so just something you could experiment they're inexpensive if you're already taking b vitamins you could just go methylated um and see if you notice a difference but otherwise you're doing everything great dude yeah how long you've been following math programs are you have been doing them for a while or just get started on them uh off and on for most of the time that I've been consistently strength training I did anabolic back in I think 23 um and then you know we had our son in early 24 so it's been hard to be consistent with that which is what's nice about the 15 program oh cool yeah cool yeah you do otherwise you're doing good bro yeah doing real good well cool I appreciate it hey can I send you a program you're following 15 you you have the other 15 another version uh no just the uh advanced the regular like 15 and 15 advanced what do you want you want 15 power lift we have 15 performance um I saw actually I've been I was thinking about like you know something related to symmetry and I went on your website and saw that there's a 15 symmetry but yeah we'll send it over you got it oh well cool appreciate it yeah you got it thanks awesome thanks guys forget easy man I had a client once they're doing good did yeah I know so my vegan clients were challenging because of and he's doing it but it was challenging get enough protein without getting so much other stuff yeah totally um and then we would supplement yeah he's definitely supplement so all my all my yeah because nutrient deficiencies tend to be higher in when you have comparable balanced diets uh in in vegan diets so we would do multivitamin and I had this one woman and I'll never forget and there's only one because I had other vegan clients and when they did when they followed the protocols everybody turned out okay but there's one woman I had I'll never forget we did everything bro we did everything we had the supplements she was taking the creatine she was hitting protein using protein powder and she just had this lingering like low energy she'd have these kind of symptoms that look like nutrient it couldn't figure it out and convinced finally just me and a functional medicine practitioner convinced her to eat eggs and it was like cholesterol you think uh I think it was it had to be either the choline or something and this is my guess uh and I've heard of other cases like this from functional medicine practitioners were like look I've had some vegan clients where we had to sit down and say you got to throw in yeah some meat eight eggs is usually like a gateway bro it was it was like night and day dude she started eating eggs and it was like I gave her steroids it was like boom she's like oh my god I feel so good I'm like yeah and the cholesterol is part of the conversation was like this because she was very much about animal welfare which uh that's the only vegans that stick to it by the way so I asked them and I said to her I said look I know this is real important to you I said but the animal you have to uh place at the top because otherwise you're you're not able to to be a good in this world is you and so she gave in ate some eggs and it was like a light bulb went off and she just she felt so much better there's only one only one client that ever happened with look if you like mine pump come find us on instagram mine pump media if your goal is to build and shape your body dramatically improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance check out our discounted rgb super bundle at mine pump media dot com the rgb super bundle includes maps anabolic maps performance and maps aesthetic nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by sal adam and justin to systematically transform the way your body looks feels and performs with detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos the rgb super bundle is like having sal adam and justin as your own personal trainers but at a fraction of the price the rgb super bundle has a full 30 day money back 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